The Most Valuable Organic Content Training You'll Ever Watch
Two operators at a whiteboard map organic content as a full funnel: what to post, how comments become booked calls, how to tie revenue to a single post, and how to pour fuel on the winners.
Posted
4 days ago
Duration
Format
Tutorial
educational
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20.5K
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57 · 43
Big Idea
The argument in one line.
Organic content is a funnel, not a view count: post awareness, nurture and conversion pieces on purpose, track which post produced the revenue, and then scale the proven winners instead of chasing new virality.
Who This Is For
Read if. Skip if.
READ IF YOU ARE…
A coach, agency owner or info-product seller already getting some views on Instagram who can't tell which posts actually produce sales calls.
Someone running comment-keyword or DM campaigns through ManyChat who wants a cleaner path from inbound message to booked call.
An operator with a working sales team who wants to know how to take one proven reel and multiply its reach with collabs, trial reels and DM ads.
A B2B seller deciding whether to optimize for reach at all, or to stay in a small pocket of the right buyers on YouTube.
A creator whose content has stalled after a strong run and wants a diagnosis beyond posting more.
SKIP IF…
You want editing, camera or hook-writing technique. This is strategy and sales-process content, not production craft.
You have no offer yet. Almost every tactic here assumes a product and a sales call to send people toward.
You sell low-ticket products checked out directly. The conversion half is built around human setters and booked calls.
TL;DR
The full version, fast.
Organic social works like a paid funnel: some posts attract strangers, some educate followers, some convert. On Instagram that maps to format, because reels reach non-followers while carousels and stories go to followers first, so the 3x3 grid pairs three formats with three funnel stages. Lead gen stays inside the app, with comment keywords for colder people and direct DM asks for warmer ones, worked by human setters who sell the creator, the vehicle and the buyer's own ability. Passing the ManyChat chat ID into the booking link ties revenue to individual posts, and proven posts get scaled through paid collabs, trial-reel variations and a simple DM ad campaign optimized for qualified calls.
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Cold-open claims, introductions, and the eight-part agenda drawn on the whiteboard, plus an earnings disclaimer.
02:48 – 07:09
02 · Organic is a funnel
Content splits into awareness, nurture and conversion. Most sales are decided long before the CTA, so the mix depends on whether you lack audience, leads or conversions.
07:09 – 24:23
03 · How each of them posts
Started with two long-form YouTube videos a week, all conversion. Now four a week mapped to conversion, nurture, awareness and mindset. Instagram sequences people through formats; posting frequency should follow proof of revenue; too much reach can pull in the wrong audience.
24:23 – 37:08
04 · Strategy and formats: the 3x3
Three formats by three funnel stages. Research what the niche already watches with Sort Feed, find brand-market fit, then use B-roll text reels for awareness, talking-head reels for nurture, and tweet-style carousels for conversion. Wording, visuals and even clothing act as targeting.
37:08 – 41:52
05 · Starting simple
The original plan: two hours a week, two iPads, two videos, a $4K/month editing team, held for two years. Repurposing to LinkedIn, X and IG flopped; native content wins. Commit to one channel first.
41:52 – 44:50
06 · Ideation
Ignore advice like 'you are the niche' or 'just document.' Work out how you want to be perceived at each funnel stage, then research what to say.
44:50 – 1:01:22
07 · Research and swipe files
Pull inspiration from your niche, adjacent niches and random ones; take contrarian angles on trending topics and tie news back to the offer. Outline instead of scripting, compare drafts to proven swipes, and spend about an hour per piece. Long-form ideas come from what clients struggle with this week.
1:01:22 – 1:10:14
08 · Lead gen with comments and DMs
Keep people on Instagram. Comment keywords catch colder people with a lead magnet; DM asks catch warmer ones for a direct conversation. Collect email and phone inside ManyChat, and follow up only after the resource is consumed. On YouTube, CTAs get peppered throughout.
1:10:14 – 1:12:07
09 · Profile optimization
A resource CTA on the third bio line, highlights for story, behind the scenes and case studies, and three pinned posts that handle objections.
1:12:07 – 1:19:54
10 · Conversion: DM setting
Human setters sell the guy, the vehicle and the buyer's ability across 12 to 15 messages. 10,000 conversations yield about 6,000 replies and 600 calls. Hire high-EQ setters, cap teams around seven, and route skeptics to a webinar when one is close.
1:19:54 – 1:26:44
11 · Data tracking
Contextual keyword CTAs plus a dynamic UTM carrying the ManyChat chat ID link a booked call and payment back to one post. Instagram's new-follower filter flags awareness winners. The counterpoint: decide content by audience needs, not by which post made money.
1:26:44 – 1:28:19
12 · Audience growth
Bet on winning horses: find the outlier posts that drove money and followers, then amplify them instead of starting over.
1:28:19 – 1:30:01
13 · Lever 1: collabs and shout-outs
Pay niche theme pages to collab on or repost a proven post. Spend runs $4K to $50K a month; keep boosting anything under $10 per lead.
1:30:01 – 1:31:23
14 · Lever 2: trial reels
Repost the winner in three or four variations: new format, speed, font, saturation or music, and recycle the set after a few weeks.
1:31:23 – 1:35:59
15 · Lever 3: DM ads
Ten proven posts, one campaign, three ad sets (1% lookalike, interest stack, broad), optimized for a qualified booked call. Some accounts see $4 inbound DMs. The YouTube parallel: collab appearances and paid distribution.
1:35:59 – 1:42:06
16 · What to do if it's not working
Evolve the message, add new formats, talk to customers, study the game, and stop reaching for topics you don't know. In a slump, chase momentum and quick wins before big wins.
1:42:06 – 1:47:47
17 · Longevity
Grow with your audience instead of repeating yourself, build a multi-layer foundation beyond one topic, and avoid burning warm followers with constant retargeting ads.
Atomic Insights
Lines worth screenshotting.
It's easier to get 5 million views on one piece of content than 100,000 views on each of 50 pieces, so one well-made post beats five rushed ones.
On Instagram, carousels are shown to followers first while reels reach non-followers, so the format you pick decides which stage of the funnel sees the post.
A post that mentioned Zillow four times filled one client's DMs with realtors, because organic distribution now keys off specific words in the content.
Image and video models read your clothes, setting and tone, so dressing like your buyer helps the algorithm find people who look and talk like them.
Going viral to the wrong audience is a cost: if the wrong people watch long enough, the algorithm keeps feeding your content to more of them.
Comment-keyword leads open DMs at lower rates than people who were told to DM you directly, because the DM ask lands on people who already consumed more content.
Asking for an email and then a phone number inside ManyChat turns a lead-magnet comment into a callable lead within two minutes.
Follow up only with people who actually consumed the lead magnet; that is the moment skepticism has turned into interest.
From 10,000 inbound DM conversations, expect roughly 60% to respond to the first message and about 10% of those to book a call.
A good setter gets the lead to say out loud that they believe in the creator, in the business model and in their own ability to do it.
Passing the ManyChat chat ID into the call-booking link lets you trace a closed sale back to the exact post and keyword that started it.
One post with 30 million views produced almost no revenue because it never tied the story back to the business; a modest post later drove close to $800K a month.
Trial reels work best as format variations of a proven winner, not as hook tests on an unproven idea.
A bare-bones DM ad campaign of one campaign, three ad sets and ten proven posts has produced inbound DMs for about $4 each at $1,000 to $2,000 a day.
Optimizing paid boosts for a qualified booked call instead of a raw lead keeps the cheap, low-quality leads out.
When the audience can predict your next post, they stop interacting, so a rigid weekly SOP slowly kills performance.
When content stalls, the fix is usually evolving the message, adding new formats and talking to current customers, not posting more.
Hammering warm followers with retargeting ads can burn them out, so they stop seeing the organic content that sold them in the first place.
Takeaway
Plan organic by funnel stage, then scale proven winners.
WHAT TO LEARN
Organic content pays when each post has a funnel job, every lead can be traced to the post that started it, and money goes into amplifying what already works.
02Organic is a funnel
Sort every post into awareness, nurture or conversion, and weight next month's mix toward whichever stage is currently your bottleneck.
Most buying decisions happen before the call to action, so nurture content that answers objections does more selling than a louder CTA.
03How each of them posts
On Instagram, reels reach non-followers while carousels and stories go to followers first, so match the format to the funnel stage.
Hold frequency to about one strong post a day until content is producing revenue, then add volume and trial reels on top.
Reach beyond your buyers can hurt, because the algorithm keeps serving the post to whoever watches it longest.
04Strategy and formats: the 3x3
Before posting, sort competitors' posts by performance over the last three months to see which formats and topics the niche already rewards.
Use three formats for three stages: B-roll text reels for reach, talking-head reels for teaching, and tweet-style carousels with direct CTAs to convert.
Specific words, visuals and even your clothing steer who the algorithm shows a post to, so speak and look like your buyer.
05Starting simple
A minimal, repeatable system, like two recorded videos a week handed to an editor, held for two years beats an ambitious plan you abandon.
Repurposing one piece everywhere underperforms; native content made for each platform does better, so commit to one channel first.
06Ideation
Posting about everything in your life confuses the algorithm about who to show you to, so keep topics tied to the buyer you want.
Decide how you want to be perceived at each funnel stage, since the same origin story can be framed for very different audiences.
07Research and swipe files
Collect inspiration from your niche, an adjacent niche and unrelated creative niches, then adapt the hooks rather than copying them.
Pair a topic already getting attention with a contrarian take relevant to your buyer, and tie news to your offer with a logical argument.
Outline in bullets (hook, context, main point, CTA) instead of scripting word for word, then check the outline against proven examples.
The most reliable ideas come from patterns in what current clients are struggling with this week.
08Lead gen with comments and DMs
Keep people inside Instagram: use comment keywords to send colder viewers a lead magnet and DM keywords to start conversations with warmer ones.
Ask for an email and then a phone number inside the DM flow, and follow up only after the person has actually consumed the resource.
09Profile optimization
Put a resource CTA on your bio's third line and use highlights for your story, behind the scenes and client results.
Pin three posts that answer the objections and awareness questions a curious profile visitor has before they'll reach out.
10Conversion: DM setting
A setter's job is to get the lead to affirm three beliefs: this person can help me, this model works, and I can do it.
Plan on roughly 60% of inbound conversations replying and 10% of those booking a call, and hire setters for emotional intelligence.
11Data tracking
Give each post its own comment keyword and pass the ManyChat chat ID into the booking link to trace sales back to individual posts.
Filter Instagram insights by new followers to find which posts grow the audience, separate from which posts make money.
Use revenue data as insight rather than a rule, because posts that close often depend on earlier posts that never get credit.
12Audience growth
When a post wins, amplify it instead of starting over; a proven piece of content is an asset you can keep pushing.
13Lever 1: collabs and shout-outs
Pay niche theme pages to collab on or reshare a proven post, and keep scaling while cost per lead stays under about $10.
14Lever 2: trial reels
Use trial reels to republish a winner in three or four variations of format, speed, font or music instead of testing new hooks on unproven ideas.
15Lever 3: DM ads
Run ten proven posts as ads in one campaign across a 1% lookalike, an interest stack and a broad ad set.
Optimize the ads for a qualified booked call, not a raw lead, so cheap low-intent leads don't swamp your sales team.
16What to do if it's not working
When content stalls, evolve the message, add a new format, talk to current customers and study what changed in your niche.
Stop posting about things you don't really know, and rebuild momentum with small wins before chasing your previous highs.
17Longevity
Your audience changes over time, so the message has to grow with them or the brand stagnates month after month.
Build a foundation beyond one topic, and avoid flooding warm followers with retargeting ads that burn the goodwill organic content built.
Glossary
Terms worth knowing.
ManyChat
A chat automation tool for Instagram and Facebook Messenger that replies to comment keywords and DMs, delivers lead magnets, and collects details like email and phone number inside the conversation.
Comment keyword CTA
A call to action asking viewers to comment a specific word on a post, which triggers an automated DM with a resource and starts a conversation.
DM setter
A salesperson who works inbound direct-message conversations, qualifies the lead, and books them onto a sales call with a closer.
Trial reels
An Instagram feature that shows a reel to non-followers first, so you can test how a piece performs with new audiences before it appears to followers.
Collab post
An Instagram post with two accounts listed as co-authors, so it appears on both feeds and reaches both audiences.
Theme page
A large niche Instagram account (business, health, psychology) that sells shout-outs or collab slots, often cheaply relative to the reach it delivers.
Sort Feed
A Chrome extension that sorts a TikTok or Instagram profile's posts by views, likes or comments over a time window, used to see what already performs in a niche.
Chat ID
ManyChat's unique identifier for each contact, which can be appended to a booking link so a sale can be traced back to the conversation and post that produced it.
UTM parameters
Tags added to the end of a link that tell your analytics where a visitor came from, such as the platform, campaign or specific post.
1% lookalike audience
A Meta ad audience built from the 1% of users most similar to a source list, such as past buyers or engaged followers.
Interest stack
A Meta ad set targeting several related interests combined, rather than one interest or a broad audience.
Custom conversion
A Meta ads event you define, such as a qualified booked call, so the algorithm optimizes delivery toward that outcome instead of cheap leads.
Andromeda
Meta's ad-delivery system update that leans heavily on the content of the ad itself to decide who sees it, making creative and wording act as targeting.
Speed to lead
How quickly a sales team responds to a new inquiry; interest drops fast, so faster responses convert better.
ICP
Ideal customer profile: the specific type of buyer a business is built to serve and wants its content to attract.
“It's easier to get 5 million views on one piece of content than 100,000 views on 50 pieces of content.”
a tight, quotable rule credited to a famous creator, needs no setup→ TikTok hook↗ Tweet quote
20:36
“If the wrong people watch my video for long enough, the algorithm's gonna start distributing that content towards those people too, because it operates off the same signal.”
contrarian take that views can hurt you→ IG reel cold open↗ Tweet quote
31:46
“They mentioned the word Zillow like four times. All of a sudden our DMs are full of realtors.”
concrete, funny proof that words act as targeting→ IG reel cold open↗ Tweet quote
35:13
“I'll spam this outfit forever because my buyer doesn't dress in suits.”
surprising, visual tip that stands alone→ TikTok hook↗ Tweet quote
37:06
“When the audience can predict you, they're not going to interact.”
“We had this one post that got 30 million views. We made the rookie error of not tying it into his business vehicle.”
cautionary story with a big number→ TikTok hook↗ Tweet quote
1:37:32
“Don't reach, or stop reaching. By reaching, I mean you're talking about some shit that you don't really know about.”
punchy diagnosis of creator burnout→ newsletter pull-quote↗ Tweet quote
The Script
Word for word.
Read-along
Don't just watch it. Burn it in.
See every word as it's spoken — crank it to 2× and still catch all of it. The same dual-channel trick behind Amazon's Kindle + Audible.
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metaphoranalogystory
It's easier to get 5 million views on one piece of content than 100 ,000 views on 50 pieces of content. This allows us to have a reel that gets, you know, a million or two million views and gets X amount of conversions to almost like triple or quadruple the effect that it gets. This took me two hours a week.
That was it. So eight hours a month. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the channel.
We got two Jeremy's here today, Jeremy Haynes and Mr. Jeremy Moser. And for all those who don't know Jeremy Moser, he's done well over a hundred million with his clients.
And then I'm Jeremy Haynes and I've made more than a million bucks a month for a fair bit of time now. To be clear, I make more than a million a month recurring. And a lot of that originates from organic.
So I'll give my perspective as we go through this as well. This is going to be an organic content masterclass. And here's what we've got for you.
We'll be going through funnel selection. Tell them what that means.
Basically, we're going to go walk through not just posting content as is, we're actually going to talk how organic in of itself is a funnel, very similar to paid ads, aka how you attract people, how you nurture them up to the point where they're actual fans, all the way up to how you turn those views and followers into paying customers.
Then we're going to yap a little bit about strategy and format. We're already going to go through how to go and take essentially like what we spoke about within the funnel and then materialize that into an actual strategy, meaning that you should know exactly what to post and how often to post. instead of looking up your local competitors and copy and pasting their shit.
A lot of people struggle with original thought, which leads us into point number three here, ideation. Then number four, we're going to go how to turn that into leads. Yeah, and then we'll talk about converting them.
We're actually going to do the one thing that probably nobody's ever actually done with organic, which is data tracking. With ads, you know, if you have conversions, you could do pixel performing. Well, there's actually a way to track the data, which allows you to not only figure out which content piece is performing you the best, we then also speak about how to use that data to make performance.
driven action. So you can actually go and scale up and squeeze the most juice out of the content pieces that actually drive in, whether that be followers, leads, or revenue for your business. Jeremy does a phenomenal job.
driving up audience growth as time goes on too. More specifically, if we talk about the audience growth, what we're going to cover is like scaling strategies to take one winning piece of content and make it last a lot longer. What to do if it's not working for all the losers that are naturally going to lose and how to turn it around and get things winning.
And then of course, optimizing for longevity. Tell them what this means. Basically, very simply put, what you see with a lot of personal brands is they come up, they have a hot few months and then they die the out.
Quick disclaimer, we're not in any way, shape or form saying you're going to go out there and do a hundred plus million dollars. We're just simply saying, hey, you're listening to qualified people who have been there, done that in this particular episode with a whole bunch of clients who have also been there, done that.
We're just handing down the lessons to you. The odds of you ever cracking 10 million a year, USD, is less than 0 .1%. This is just for education and maybe even a little bit of entertainment purposes here today.
So without further ado. Let's get started. The first thing we got to dive in on is funnel selection, Jeremy.
Where specifically do you want to start there? So the first thing that I want to start at is actually understanding that organic in of itself is an actual funnel, meaning that most people, they have this very blatantly weird view where they think, oh, I'm going to just go and get this supposed to be eyeballs. And then somehow this is going to turn into money, right?
Which is just not the case. What it should be in reality is it should actually be a funnel. where essentially you understand that, hey, if I'm posting content, there's different kinds of content.
There's some content that might attract people. There's some that might educate them, and there's some that convert them. And vice versa, if you actually go and do that properly, there's going to be certain formats that do that entire job for you.
Now, again, very simply put, to put this in Lehman's terms, when you attract someone, you drive, simply put, awareness, which means you're going to find someone that goes, oh, I've never heard of Mr. Jeremy Haynes. That's an interesting person.
So you've got to understand, how do you accomplish that very feat? Vice versa, once you actually have followers, how do you educate those people?
Meaning, how do you now educate them on your business model? How do you educate them on like who you are as an individual? As well, why they should give a fuck about actually purchasing from you?
And then obviously, last but not least, how do you liquidate those eyeballs? Meaning, essentially, how do you get them to go to a point where they're like, hey, I actually want to give you some money. So very simply put, this is top of funnel, right?
This is obviously middle of funnel. And then the last thing is bottom of the funnel. Now, what most people get wrong very blatantly is like, outside the conversion level, they're like, hey, I just need to go and like throw out a CTA, which like, that's not very much the case.
More often than not, the conversion happens long before they actually reach out. It needs to be psychologically induced where they consume so much information, very similar to obviously a lot of the strategies you've had that were content first, where by the time they see a call to action, they're like, wow, I'm already sold.
And they jump on onto the call wanting to actually purchase as opposed to evaluating. So your version of funnel selected is first making sure that people are aware when you go and do organic content, it's not just a game of eyeballs. You try to...
essentially layer the types of eyeballs that you're going to get yep now does this when you talk about funnel selections specifically tie into what type of funnel you're actually going to pick Not as much. And I think you're more qualified to speak on this.
But I remember once in a while you did this call where you spoke about when you go from organic to paid, you should choose specific funnels, right? I actually believe the same to be true when you go from paid towards adding an organic layer. Meaning that as an example, if you're really successful with like a low ticket funnel, for me, the conversion element that I would choose, right?
And obviously we can go into how this actually materializes would be more similar to an actual low ticket funnel. Whereas if I'm just starting out, I might just do like a DM funnel because there's no fancy tech stack and whatnot.
How this materializes would be as an example, it would be the awareness might just be content in of itself, right? So like actual like reels, you know, maybe it would be like a carousel. Then the nurture term would essentially go and be more content.
So the same thing there, but it would actually also include IG stories, right? It might include an IG live. It might include like a YouTube video or it might even include like a lead magnet.
And then obviously - Oh, I think I'm getting it. So you're saying like your version of a quote unquote funnel, you're saying the organic content is the funnel technically. That's your argument.
And then the very bottom, the actual conversion is where the conversion funnel comes in. Where would that be? Yeah, like the call funnel or a DM ad or whatever.
Exactly. Whatever originates the actual conversion. Okay, so you're saying - When somebody actually thinks with organic content, awareness, nurture, conversion are the steps that we want to actively think through.
And is there like a ratio of how much you're selecting of one thing or the other in terms of these three different levels? It all comes down to like intention, right? So for an example, if I'm in a situation where I'm like, hey, my audience is dry.
I have no fucking needs. Yeah, you got to grow it. Yeah, you got to go and do that.
Whereas if you're like, hey, we get, you know, 50 million views, like. I make no sales. I'm actually going to switch the content that I make to what's very like conversion oriented, like make sure I actually liquidate the eyeballs.
Or if you get both leads and views, right? But you don't get the conversions, then I would go and focus heavily on like education, objection handling based content where people actually think, oh yeah, this person actually can help me, which then makes actually driving revenue simple. So it's based on what you actually need.
Let me show you what I did. Okay. So I, when I first started, this was on July.
of 2024, my version of the funnel would have just been conversion.
I thought to myself, I was like, all right, I want to make some more content. At the time I was trying to test against a thesis I had. I thought the thesis was I can't attract my ideal marketing agency client through content.
I've proven that time and time again, but I don't want to be right in opinion. I want to be right in reality. So I go back and I test against what I actually believe to be true.
So I started testing, thinking to myself, I'm gonna make content that's like conversion -oriented content to try to get somebody to actually take an action to become an agency client of ours. And I'm just gonna make content towards the person who I think is like, you know, almost there, but like needs some gap that they're dealing with closed.
My entire process was just, I'm gonna make, this is all I did to start. I started with two specific videos a week, okay? And with the two a week that I'd specifically post.
All I would do in those videos was look at what my actual clients were dealing with at different stages in their journey. So I would technically talk to like different levels of problems that they had. Some of their problems I'd communicate might've been like a newer problem they just uncovered or somebody might've been stuck for a long period of time or somebody might've been in between a decision that I might be able to help them out with or aid them with or.
Simply put, there was some specific thing that I've already been there, done that, and dealt with with other clients or my own business that I felt like I could be very articulate with them. But when I say my content funnel strategy was just make two long -form videos a week, post them to YouTube. That was literally it.
Call to action every video, multiple times a video, push them to a specific set of offers. I would say the biggest thing on this is I did get zero awareness, though, to be fair. The only awareness I initially got, to your point, was the awareness that I already had.
I had a little bit of a word of mouth effect where people would share it with other people because they were valuable videos. That was where a lot of my new awareness would originate. But to his point, optimizing around actual awareness in your content makes a substantial difference to new eyeballs routinely coming to you without the word of mouth effect being factored in.
Also to factor in the biggest thing that I like to say is like business to business versus business to consumer is like a fairly different like approach, right? Because I think with business to business, when you go and like do like lifestyle based, like super viral content, that drives in a very poor audience. And like, I think you and I both hate like poor audiences to sell to.
Yeah. Shouldn't be watching this if you're poor. Yeah.
You need to see audiences that works a lot better, right? Because you get like very unaware people. Whereas for someone like yourself, you want to start more like even stuff that might be conversion oriented.
somehow we'll get a small discovery effect. But that's besides the point. No, it's true.
Okay, here's what I do now, okay? So in this day and age, I do four long form videos. And out of the four long form videos that I do, three of them get posted to the main channel, okay?
And the Monday video, the Wednesday video, and then I do a Saturday video on the main channel. And then I do a Sunday video on my second channel that I've got, which is called Jeremy Haynes Lessons for the Kids. Okay, now listen to this.
My Monday video is my idea specifically for like what I think my people need to know. And to your point in terms of how you'd frame it, this would be a conversion video for sure. My Wednesday video is a business breakdown video where I sit down with people in the chair and I get them to articulate their current circumstances in business to me.
And I help them leave with a scaling plan with something that they could go do. This is demonstration content to me is how I articulate it. But if I put it in your awareness nurture, or conversion box, I actually make very little call to actions throughout this particular video.
This particular video on my Wednesday video is much more of a nurture video. I don't really optimize it around awareness. However, my Saturday video, my Saturday video, I do optimize around awareness.
And I do consider how I could reach more overall viewers now. And so to your point, without even being able to articulate it in a technical idea. up until you just shared your framework, this would technically be awareness, nurture, and conversion.
And in this video on Sunday, my lessons for the kids video, this is actually what it's named. I actually just make lessons for my kids, but I also consider it like a secondary audience. It doesn't belong on my main channel because again, it's lessons for my children.
But at the same time, this is like my mindset content. And so you could also consider this to be like awareness or nurture content. There's zero call to actions in this.
So obviously it wouldn't be conversion optimized. But yeah, to your point, His strategy of awareness, nurture, and conversion fits literally into what I do to the T, just without saying the exact same words.
If you consider it like, let's say you do business to consumer, which I think most people actually do, right? Because of such little awareness, they probably aren't even aware of their financial problems, as an example, or health problems. So they got to go and be like, oh yeah, I've actually had the same problem.
I didn't even know I was that - you know? And then they then enter obviously your funnel, right?
From there, it's about like understanding that like, oh, there's these different ways, like there's these different problems and oh, here's how I could solve them. And then ultimately by the time they're like, I actually got to solve a problem. I'm about to be homeless, you know?
When you articulate this system that you've visualized here of the awareness, nurture and conversion, usually in the context of an actual funnel, like we get the benefit of sequencing. So as an example, in an actual funnel itself, like a marketing funnel where we say we have an opt -in page and then this page and that page and that page, we know what the person is going to receive in the order that we want them to receive it.
In the context of how you're articulating the funnel with the awareness, nurture, and conversion, even in mine. Like somebody could originate at any point within that video process. And people do regularly.
Do you find that the algorithms are moving people through this particular sequence, like in order? 100%. There's two different ways.
That's actually rather profound. So essentially, like, and I'm not going to go pretend this is how it actually works, but it's based on our experience, how we've seen it. So let's say somebody is just like this random individual.
who's just like, you know, browsing Instagram and they see a reel as an example, right? And they go, oh, I really liked this video. What's going to happen is Instagram immediately goes, oh, this person engaged with this kind of content, which means older videos that you've seen, they immediately show them more to that individual.
Yeah, of course. Now, what happens is based on the format that you post, different people see it. So what we then do to go and say, okay, there's three stages, right?
Stranger who like just sees a video, likes it. gets immediately retargeted with older videos. Then obviously after a few videos, he might then go and say, hey, do you know what?
Like, I actually want to become a follower, right? They put the plus away. The moment they get a plus, they get retargeted in a sense or they're more likely to go and see formats such as Instagram stories and carousels because this is as per the definition by Instagram.
Carousels are shown first to followers and only afterwards eventually to non -followers. Whereas... Reels are shown to non -followers as well as followers.
And so naturally speaking, I'm aware that like if I do something that's very broad and is supposed to bring in new audience, I might actually go and do it around the top of all concept to drive awareness. And then if I do an education or like nurture kind of piece, I do it in a format or on a place. within the platform of Instagram, where I understand that, oh, they're actually more likely to now actually watch that kind of content because they already follow me.
So your logic is, is you're essentially chumming the waters with all three of these different types of content with the expectation that in this case, Instagram's algorithm is going to strategically sequence that information in front of a person based on. intent and interest because we see the different formats and who they distributed out to we know what topics to package with the specific format because again once somebody now is a follower they might originally see like a story and then if they engage with the story the story on your phone, that profile keeps skipping further to the left.
And so now you understand that like the people who actually watch the story the most frequent are the most bought in, which means when you drop a CTA, those are the actual people that will then want to go buy into it. So on Reels specifically, are you mainly posting awareness and nurture content and you're not posting conversion oriented content?
Exactly. So your conversion oriented content would be story CTAs with like link clicks. Or like say this word to us in the reply.
Exactly. Or how often out of 10 pieces of content do you think you're posting a conversion optimized reel? Inside a conversion optimized reel.
It really depends again on the strategy, but I would say on average, if we post seven times a week, we would do it on, if we post two carousels, both carousels are going to have like a more direct CTA because again, they're more nurtured people. Whereas. On a reel that's more tactical, we might do like two CTAs.
But again, those call to actions would then go to a nurture asset, such as the lead magnet or a YouTube video, which then again, increase the likelihood of them consuming the content. Now you mentioned a specific thing there that you kind of grazed over. I want you to highlight.
I think it's a good talking point for us, which is. the frequency in which you're posting on a week. So I think, especially when it comes down to Instagram, right?
You have way more insights on YouTube. But for Instagram in of itself, I like to start. If I make less than a hundred grand from content, I would just post once a day.
Because the thing is, it's like content creation in of itself is a skill. I mean, if you just whip out your phone, you just go and you just do five pieces, five pieces of shit. Are not going to go and equate to any form of sales.
That's true. I would rather put, especially business to consumers about being intentional. Yeah.
These average human beings see so much content where like you just yapping about the same content doesn't stand out. But if you have a creative angle, you have a unique, like if a special hook. they stick through.
And if you can articulate yourself well, that one piece of content is actually more effective. As an example, Beast actually said this, Mr. Beast in a video, he said, it's easier to get 5 million views on one piece of content than 100 ,000 views on 50 pieces of content.
We're a big believer in our agency off of that. We're like, if we have one piece of content that just pops up in the right way, we can flood follower account and DMs way more than just mass posting and then just harassing those poor people who engage. No.
A question, because you do this as a done for you agency right now, and then you have some consulting deals that you help people with too. In the context of like your bias there, do you think that you also just wanting to be more efficient would naturally reduce the overall quantity of content that you think should get posted per day?
No, I think now with trial reels, we've increased like overall posting, but I think from zero to like a hundred grand a month, as an example, like it will be my benchmark. It's like less is more. Don't even talk to people going to zero to 100K.
Talk as though these guys are already doing a couple of 100K a month and they're looking for a strategy to amplify what they're already doing or get to the next level. If you have proof of concept above a hundred grand a month and you post, hey, if I post X amount of pieces of content, this is how many views I get. You can now understand, okay, I have a certain skill where I can predictably get X amount of leads.
Now you already make money, right? You have proof of concept. Now you actually have an incentive to go double down.
Because I believe I wouldn't put an effort into something that's not making me any money. And so once you do that up, I like to go two times a week, scale through trial reels, which we'll cover a lot later. And then ultimately, we...
I would recommend you tap out of about three times a day plus trial reels. We've just seen that anyone who spans over that in the business to consumer space reverts back, which I'm very convinced in is due to revenue like affections. Watch this.
I did the opposite of what you said. So I post three times a week on the main channel. I post once a week on the second channel lessons for the kids.
Plus I technically also post give or take how many of these I can get out. I had a clipping channel. called the Hanes Feed.
And I repurposed it. The clipping channel was going nowhere. It was content from videos like this that we would just like clip out and put onto another channel.
And we actually were told by a bunch of guys that have like way more YouTube views and subscribers than I do that that's a terrible idea. They were like, it should actually be unique content that you put on the third channel. So then I was like, I gotta film more unique content.
So on the third channel specifically, listen to this. I'll sit down, okay, and I'll film usually about It equates to about one of these a day, but we got about, I think five off last week, if I remember correctly on this.
There are Q and A videos. So we look at Jeremy AI users. We literally like take their actual questions.
We turn around and we answer those questions with something that could be like a two minute to upwards of a 15 minute yap video where I'm sitting here with visualizing something on the iPad and we're trying to turn the third channel into unique content. Sick. So usually it's about five a week.
on the third channel, okay? And the third channel being like a Q &A video channel now. And those have surprisingly been referenced a little bit.
We're barely into the test so far. In terms of like how all this works, this is a test. This is consistent.
You know, this is consistent. Here's another test we're running right now that breaks your theory that we were just saying. So eight times a day on IG.
Okay. And now watch this. Like I said, I'm not technically optimized around views.
I actually believe when I get a lot of views. It's a negative thing. Like as an example, I did this talk on YouTube I dropped recently, the Get Richer talk.
And at that Get Richer talk, like at first, only reaching the right people, like the best people. Then as it gets upwards of like 100 plus thousand views, I go, uh -oh. Between like, at the time I'm making this video, I think it got up to like 170 so far.
So like between about 100 and 170, I had to limit the comments of people who were only subscribed to me for like upwards of three weeks. Because I started getting comments from regular people. And I knew that the video had officially gone beyond.
the targeted audience that I actually want. And to be very clear with you, here's how I look at it. I look at it like, if the wrong people watch my video for long enough, the algorithm's gonna start distributing that content towards those people too, because it operates off the same signal.
And I don't want it to do that. I literally don't want it to feed it to the wrong people. I only want it to feed it to like the most concentrated pocket of the right people.
And maybe like a little bit beyond that is my most ideal scenario where they're still technically my people, but they may not know me yet. And that could be like a video that reaches them. But then the pocket beyond that is regular people.
And that specific pocket, I get blasted every time I ever reach that regular pocket because my messaging is not for regular people. This, believe it or not, I'm not exaggerating when I say this, helps prevent reaching that third layer of regular people.
I know this sounds ridiculous to you. I know it does. Dude, the shit I'm posting, I have like four videos a day at least that go out that are either clips from videos like this or unique content.
I'll sit down and I'll film reels, but I'll also post Jeremy AI testimonials. Dude, I'm not even going to talk about that specific company's revenue at this point because it's just compounding like crazy. And I don't want people to go and copy that like everybody copies all my other shit.
But listen to this, okay? It's doing quite well. And out of those eight posts a day, I might get like one to two of the posts that gets like tens of thousands of views.
Almost all the other views will be like in the thousands, okay? And that doesn't sound like a lot, right? If I get a video that gets like whatever, a couple thousand views, first of all, I never even get hundreds anymore.
But like, look how many just a thousand people is, right? Look how many 3 ,000 people. I just literally think I'm like, my piece of content is in front of all these fuckers.
Somewhere between this and this is like my average view count on a video. And I believe that I'm like. Oh, I'm in the pocket.
You know, I think I'm like reaching the right people like again and again and again and really helping them. But to your point, I never reach this with the IG clips specifically because I'm not using your awareness strategy. I agree.
But I also think for you, that's not what you want, right? Because if you look at this conversation, you, your total addressable market of people that you can sell to, like if you look at the percentage of like 10 ,000 views off of like, what, 200 ,000 people, maybe you reach like. 5 % to 10 % of your total addressable market.
Whereas for someone who sells to regular people, you obviously need that more bigger mass market. Dude, here's the other important thing to point out about what you're saying. Those people are optimizing around transactional revenue.
In my business, I optimize around recurring revenue. So like when I transact with somebody, they're gonna transact with me again, unless they make less than 50K a month, again and again and again and again, right? Now, to be clear, and this is like what I'm saying and the difference in strategy here that lends to both your people and mine is yours is an attention optimized strategy because you have to have more attention to perpetuate a transaction oriented business.
I can spam the... Got a conversion content and nurture content and barely tap awareness content because I get a word of mouth effect to the right people. And in addition to that, I have a recurring revenue optimized business, meaning a majority of the products I'm ever going to sell you are going to be a recurring product.
That's very interesting how that plays into the thesis. As a small disclaimer, like though we want to go and get views, if we go like to like a more like business to consumer, like mass market audience. It's not that we're trying to spam for views because with the changes happening from actually paid ads and Dromita, the messaging on Instagram is more important than ever now.
So you got to be a bit more witty about that too. But aside from that, I'm very aligned in like how our strategy is slightly different there. Makes sense.
Okay, next one that we need to cover. is strategy and formats okay lead the way okay so when it comes down to the actual strategy right very similar to you already broke it down kind of on the youtube side yeah what i like to kind of do is like very simply put it's like a three by three so what i refer to by a three by three is essentially like we have top of funnel middle of funnel bottom of funnel right which we just kind of discussed and this is purely off of instagram to be quite frank with you we essentially want to go and have three formats and three topics so instead of just having this like big gray net where you're like do you have no clue what to post like what to talk about i want to figure out what is my ideal client audience or my demographic already engaging with what are the topics within my specific niche or like the formats that are already working and then so i kind of like cost this net of like figuring out what what the niche is already liking and what they actually want to go and do and then i figure out what of that can i serve with unique information
Or what of those formats are like, you know, comparatively to me? And so by researching the niche and then looking what you have to kind of offer, you find what I would call brand market fit in the middle. And so naturally.
So things that people are watching. Yep. And then things that you want to do.
Like things that people are watching in my niche, like what if I have a real estate offer? What in the real estate offer, what are the formats and topics that people already engage with, right? And what about those topics and things do I feel compelled to talk about or I feel I have a unique leverage?
Because again, then I already know I'm betting on a winning horse as opposed to just like moonshotting my way to like potentially going viral. And then I understand the behavior of the niche already a lot better, which means now I can select. How are you researching this?
Are you just going on IG and just searching words? So on Instagram, you have this extension. It's called Sort Feed.
And you can literally just go on your competitor's profile, essentially run the Sort Feed extension. It filters it by performance last three months. It's a Chrome extension?
Yeah, it's a Chrome extension. Sort Feed? Sort Feed.
You can then throw it into an LLM and then go, oh, what are some of the commonalities? Or you just look at it for actually five minutes, like a focused individual. When we launch, as an example, if we launch new clients, that's all we do.
Because we already understand, oh, this is actually working. Oh, these are the topics that people give a shit about. And then if we have like unique takes on it, we can play into that, which means our chances of success are already a bit higher.
Yeah, makes sense. Because what we spoke about on the strategy at first, I then understand, for example, hey, let's say those Instagram reels where you have like text plus B -rolls overlay, right? I understand, okay.
over here, I might want to do like B -roll based content. And I speak about topic one, topic two, topic three. So this represents three different formats.
Yeah. So this would be format one. Yep.
Format two. Yep. Format three.
Yeah. So this first format you reference is what you call B -roll. Yeah.
So for us, for example, for like awareness -based content, right? And this is just what we chose to do for some clients. Yeah.
We basically do B -roll. plus text. So that's like getting in and out of a car, working, sitting on your laptop, typing stuff and just text over and over.
We call it silent storytelling. I call it static reels. Yeah.
Okay. So that's format one. Yeah.
And if you say, okay, the niche is consuming that type of format. Yep. I'm going to plug the things that I have unique perspective on into that format.
There's a high probability that I'm going to get the attention. And now we know based on data that this particular format is very likely to actually get millions of views. Now I look at that and say, hey, this is how I can attract people.
So then I understand what are topics now that people are likely to like resonate with at like a higher scale. So instead of me doing like a deep financial audit on like, for example, a real estate topic, I might just do something like I tell my story, which like the typical, like, you know, whether it's racks to riches, like fats to fit, like that kind of vibe.
And so that would be like my first topic. I have this hilarious guy on Instagram I've been seeing. He'll compare Canadian real estate to French castles.
And it's his awareness content. And he sits there and he just reviews properties that are inside of Canada that look like beater pieces of shit. And then he'll show you a French castle.
And at first I was like, oh, this guy's just making like funny content. And then by like the second or third time I saw it, I was like, what's he selling? You know?
And so I clicked his profile. Dude, the guy's selling the castles. So he's just ragging on.
different real estate markets and he expanded beyond Canada now. He's like, he's like, let's go look in California and see like what you could get for a million too. And he's making like, you know, funny banter.
So you're saying, okay, if somebody saw that and they were like, all right, that's getting views, right? Like that guy clearly very creatively as a real estate agent selling castles, came up with that as an attention format. And then he just spams that format repeatedly and gets a ton of people out.
Okay. That makes sense. So in this case, that's your is that your awareness that'd be my awareness okay and then does this format logic also follow like that means this one would be nurture and this one would be conversion exactly got it so for your nurture format are you doing the same thing like we're looking again in the niche the same format got it the biggest thing that i would say there's two things away Like, and again, I'm not saying it's like to be super strict of it.
Like you can obviously like expand it a bit, but it's just like a good like thinking format to start out with. To me, I like to have two real formats, at least that's what we usually try or test with. We have another real format, whether that be like a green screen, whether that be like a talking head, right?
Whatever it might be, just one that you feel. And then like more like, I would say this on this layer, you want to pick more like tactical topics. So like, as an example, if we're talking like, you know, if it's, if you're selling an Airbnb offer, it would be like doing your own prop.
breakdowns it'd be like explaining like law changes and how it affects like airbnb like Kind of like being the information source. Yeah, like information stuff.
So like the guy selling castles, he's going to spam content about the markets that you could buy a castle in. Exactly. Different regions of France that might make more sense over another.
How much it costs to buy a castle. Renovations of the castles, right? Do you have cell service in the castle?
Like that would be like the nurtured content that gets you closer to like, I might buy a castle. And then you go to conversion? And then you go into the conversion, which is like, I think it's a bit difficult to go and clearly abstract, but I'm going to just give you two layers.
So we like to use what's called carousels. And like you've known us for a while, I think we've really pioneered this kind of format. The tweets.
Yes, the Twitter carousel. This guy spams the tweet threads that just look like they're screenshotted from Twitter. And honestly, they do insane as a format.
It does do really good. This is your conversion content that you like to spam? Yes.
And you do that because it's got the call to actions. And this gets shown to followers. So this is very probable to be shown to people who are already pretty engaged.
And so all we do is like, let's use the castle guy, right? So like, it would either be like a very deep financial breakdown. It'll be like, hey, I just bought this castle.
Like, here's everything you need to know. Like, it would be like really deep. We're like, if someone's in the consideration phase, again, if you look at like, you know, the typical five stages of awareness, someone's really at the bottom.
Like, what's the type of content they would need? This could be like, If you're going to buy a castle, do this.
Or a client case study. Like as an example, we don't do them. We sold this guy a castle.
Here's how it went. Yes. We reframe it though and turn it into a story as opposed to like jerking off to like, I'm so awesome.
I sold this castle. We go like, hey, this is this guy. He just bought a castle.
Like here's like exactly the process that he went through. Yeah. Here's our client, John, who bought this castle in this area in France.
And it shows like a sick photo of it. And as they carousel along, they're real, yeah. It explains the process.
And really the thing that I say here on the carousels, we want people to visualize like, oh, this is how life would look like if I implemented this. This is what the step, this is the what looks like. So they like subconsciously get sold on the idea.
And then when you hit them with the CTA at the end, they're like. Yeah. And this is the exact shift that I mentioned earlier.
Like you obviously made plenty of videos on Andromeda. The same thing happened on Organic where like all of a sudden, like we had this one client and like, you know, like our guys, they put on a post and they mentioned the word Zillow like four times. Yeah.
Like all of a sudden, like, dude, our DMs are full of fucking realtors. I feel like, why the fuck are there so many realtors? And we realized, oh, the word Zillow, now on Organic, it's shown to people who are very likely to engage with Zillow.
Of course. And so now we're very purposely leveraging like verbiage and like, you know, obviously at the different layers, like more or less specific verbiage, to actually get ideal people in.
Meaning that if we advertise to like very corporate people, we will use like, hey, ex -JP Morgan, or like, you know, my corporate W2. Like just those sprinkle words in, which like... drastically, drastically improve the actual lead quality that you're probable to get from organic content.
Now, I may be exposing something here that you're doing as like a ultra pro tip, because I don't know if you're actually doing this or not. So excuse me if I'm airing out something that's like a crazy high leverage secret. I saw a reel this morning and it said that there is a way when you edit the actual video itself, like in the edits app as an example, where they're naming.
the audio files or the video files with a load of keywords that relate to whoever they're trying to target and whoever they're trying to get in front of. And I believe what you're saying to be true. I've experienced it on the paid advertising side many times over where I tell people words make the algorithm very sensitive.
It turns it into a diabolical setup where like, We had this guy, Mason, gets in front of the room here, gets a million dollar a month trophy. And he had to use paid ads to like get his way up to the million bucks a month.
And he says, man, at one point in the middle of trying to attract the right people, we're trying to sell a copywriting course. I use. AI is a reference for, dude, you can be as powerful as well -known authors like JK Rowling with this set.
And he mentions it as like the tiniest little two words, author and JK Rowling. And he says all he got through that specific ad was a bunch of wannabe authors, which was not what he wanted at all. And so to your point, like in regards to this entire process, the keyword optimization.
Has the same level of sensitivity organically it sounds like as it does on the paid ad side not not even keywords It's actually the visuals as well. So like yeah, it'd be every on on the b -roll in Texas an example We're very specific or other teams very specific about the types of people select because they pick up on these miniscule little Nuances did I actually make changes off of it who their target your heard of Google vision?
Yes, I show people this tool all the time. So there's this tool from from Google Cloud It's called Google vision Okay, and if you go Google it and all you got to do is just upload something.
And Google is demonstrating to you how its specific AI image tool and AI video interpretation tool will break down and interpret like what's actually in the image or what's actually in the video. And sometimes people don't understand like how much these image models pick up or these video models pick up from what you're actually showing.
And so this is really important that people understand this. Like it picks up. Every emotion that you actively have, it picks up things for how it feels your tonality is.
It picks up all the stuff, obviously, from like even the style that you're actively communicating from. Like my specific style, this is a good pro tip. I never, ever.
will wear suits. I'll never ever dress up in like Laurel Piana and come make a video here. It's like, dude, I got nice clothes, right?
But like these specific clothes I always wear, I'll spam this outfit forever because my buyer doesn't dress in suits. My buyer usually doesn't come to me fully decked out in Laurel Piana. My buyer usually comes to me as like an internet marketer that works from their crib or somebody that's actively got an office where it's a pretty relaxed.
non -corporate environment. And they look and sound and talk like me. You know, they use words like me.
And algorithmically, I've always known that those specific variables, like of the character itself, will naturally get me in front of the people who are more probable to resonate with how I'm communicating and who it appears I'm communicating as. And you're reinforcing that with the perspective here you're providing of the sensitivities of the algo.
Okay, so these are your three awareness, nurture, And conversion optimized. The three by three is what you called it?
Yeah, three by three. Got any other pro tips on this? No, realistically, like what we do is like, obviously, especially as you start posting more, especially to see proof of concept, you then go cycle, right?
Like we like to look at like what are new formats we can go and test. And again, like Jan was my business partner. Like he cycles a lot with the team.
Like, hey, we should try this or we should innovate on that front. Because again, if you just cook the same, as much as it's good to have a pattern, because it makes your brand visible. Plus it makes things easier.
Yes. But over time, if you just ram it too much, it almost like kills the impact of it. Internally, we hate the SOP workers because they basically just like SOP everything.
On Monday, I'm going to post a B -roll reel with like a transformation story. But it's like what we found is like when we've actually stuck to that, the impact goes down because people predict, yep, I'm about to go and see a sub story and I'm going to see a CTA. So you've got to have a bit of like creative flow with it because otherwise it becomes too predictable.
Yeah, it makes sense. When the audience can predict you, they're not going to interact. Dude, so when I started with just organic content in general and I considered like what I should do, this is my entire plan right here.
This was it. I said, okay, first of all, I thought in time, okay? Because like when launching your organic content strategy or launching an additional channel, I was already making great money elsewhere.
And I thought to myself, like I couldn't take a lot of time for this. This took me two hours a week. That was it.
So eight hours a month. And I did it in the simplest way possible. I had two iPads.
I had one iPad film and I had one iPad I draw on, okay? And I didn't look at anybody. I didn't do the go look at what people are consuming.
I just said super selfishly, I'm gonna sit down and I'm just gonna film these two videos a week. I hired an editing team that cost me at the time, I think it was like about four grand a month. I got eight videos out a month.
You know, they'd make the thumbnails, they'd make the headlines, they'd optimize the descriptions and all that. And I would just simply make the content and then hand it over to them in a little Google Drive folder. I'm without exaggerating, did that for about two years.
That was, that was about what I did to about July of 2026. Okay. I scaled consistently through that period of time.
I got more attention in that good period. And that period of time, I got more goodwill in that period of time. And this was literally it.
And I didn't vary from that strategy. Sometime in between there, I stopped using an iPad to film and I started using like cameras and stuff. And I started using lights, you know, got a little more serious, right?
And then eventually sometime also within that two years, I started testing other channels. Now I hate LinkedIn. I hate it with all my heart.
There's nothing I like about LinkedIn. I think it's a spam hellhole. Okay, but I still, I joke about this all the time.
I still post on LinkedIn, but it's not me. It's my team actively posting on LinkedIn. And they just take these videos and they repurpose them into LinkedIn.
Same thing with tweets. My tweets for a long period of time during that specific window were mainly repurposed tweets from these longer videos and the lessons from them. Again, run by a team.
Now from there, I would also try. to clip the videos and just throw them on IG for the sake of throwing them. But LinkedIn, Twitter, and IG all performed like shit when I would just try to repurpose content exclusively.
I even tried to take that content and turn it into blogs, which we still do today on jeremyhaines .com. So anyway, here's the moral of the story. Then I had to evolve.
So like strategy -wise, like that's what got it started. And I think an important thing to point out on the strategy that you guys need to consider is Start with something easy.
I think Jeremy's strategy that he articulated is also super easy. The three by three. But you got to do something.
It's like it's got to be simple for you to actually do. I think a lot of people don't get in motion. I actually really like the fact that I was able to get in motion, you know, be willing to go up and make some mistakes and like tweak and like, you know, change stuff as time went on, because that's what ultimately got me to where I'm at today and the current process that we have in comparison.
But I also would say. As an add -on, I think the smart thing was that like you went to where your audience is actually at, right? I didn't know that.
But I think that's like a decent assumption, right? Because I think for me, if I'm like business to consumer mostly, I wouldn't go and start with like posting on YouTube because the ramp up period is high. Whereas business to business, like you, I would do that 10 out of 10 days.
I just, it's purely a selfish decision. I had no clue that they were on YouTube. I literally just said.
That's where I want to go film. You know, I feel like I can do it still to this day. I'm not my best at shooting short form content.
I feel like it's a skill gap for me. I'm actively closing it and I'm getting better at it. I do sit down now and I film like, you know, four reels and I do sit down and I write tweets, you know, I still don't do jack for LinkedIn.
I really don't think I ever will. But to be fair, like. When I've sat down and actually make content for that platform, just as a part of the strategy, it's always done exceptionally better in comparison to if I try to like efficiently repurpose all my shit to be everywhere at once.
But either way, I still deeply believe in this. I still deeply believe in the fact that doing that helped me a lot to just get in motion, learn those lessons the hard way. Hopefully you don't have to learn them the hard way, but just commit to.
a specific channel first. I think that's the main lesson here that we're trying to articulate to you. For him, he'd say, if you're selling B2C, you should run reels, it sounds like.
And you should also optimize a lot around of awareness. For me, it sounds like, again, unknowingly to me, I'm no genius here. I just went and said, I got to do something that just gets me in motion on this.
I have no idea what else I could plug into with as much confidence as what I could with YouTube. And it was just a test, as I mentioned initially. I didn't even have any grander intent.
than just, can I prove myself wrong here and maybe get a deal or two, you know? So it worked out well. So anyway, now that we've gone through strategies and formats, anything else you want to add on this?
That's it. Okay, cool. Next thing that we're going to talk about is the ideation side of things, which is a super critical layer to this whole process, if we're being honest.
What specifically do you have as best practices that you want to tell these people as it relates to ideation? Are you looking outside of yourself? Are you using AI?
So like, what do you do? Two things. I want to start with one principle.
I think it's one of the best guiding principles that I've learned, which is, it was this conundrum around focus, right? The easiest way to focus is to identify elimination and do the opposite of it. And so to me, that's exactly the one thing I do.
I look at what like a lot of people say, and then I kind of like to do the opposite. So as an example, right now, there's like a lot of like, in my eyes, nonsense that's being spewed out there. Like you are the niche, you know?
Like, aka, like, just make content around everything that is going on in your life. Or it's like, oh, like, be an expert. So long story short, like, all these advices, like document, like all of that bullshit, that's cool, but it doesn't actually achieve the funnel outcome that you really want.
Yeah, because we want to make content to make money. We're trying to get richer. Exactly.
You are the niche. Cool. I make a bunch of random content.
What happens is trickle -down effect. Algorithm's confused. Are you a gardener or are you a fucking business owner?
Lord knows. Yeah, because if you show them a bunch of random shit, it gets shown to the wrong people. That's a fair point.
Now, second thing, you want to be an expert. This is good because you actually have qualified people in. But in the context of like, you know, a bit of a broader business to consumer spectrum they like to operate on.
Yeah. There's 20 people that can make a how to or like, hey, you know, like best practices video. Yeah.
The real differentiator in that perspective becomes your story, your opinions, like who you are as a person. Agree. Just being like a fucking, you know, like basically dork who can just talk about one thing is actually going to shoot you in the foot.
Yeah. Last but not least, most people are pretty that don't have much to talk about, you know? Like no disrespect, you talk about documenting, cool.
Yeah, Greg Lavecchia, you know, and like this other e -comm guy, they're documenting. You know, people are like, oh yeah, I need to be an entertainer like TGR. That's an outlier.
You're probably not, you don't have the personality of TGR. Don't optimize around that. Yeah, that's fair.
So my biggest thing on ideation is like, I look with like, what's like these random advisors and I ignore those. And then I zoom back into this little circle where I go top of funnel, middle of funnel, bottom of funnel. The question that I ask myself is like, what does someone need to essentially become aware of who I am?
And like a qualified way of becoming aware of who you are or just aware of who you are in general? I would say who I am as a person, right? And then I say, how would I want to be perceived?
So as an example, in my context, I could either go and say the journey of like I was in college and had no money, or it could be like, hey, I started this company and like we started blowing someone up on Instagram. Yeah. It's the same story, but framed very differently.
Agree. Based off of that, I then understand, okay, cool. Here's some of the ways that I want to be aware of or how I want to be positioned.
And then based on that, I then go out and research. What are elements that I could go and talk about? And then I cross -reference it with my research above and I cross -reference what I have to offer and want to talk about.
What's the research from the second step? So the first one, you said something about a Chrome extension. Yeah, so that'd be SwordFeed.
The second one, believe it or not, one, we just like to follow people in the industry. So like this is kind of we call it like the expansion where essentially we look at people who are in the niche, right? AKA like actual competitors or creators in that niche.
Then we like to kind of expand one layer first, which is like adjacent niche. right so like if it's like airbnb would go like broader real estate yeah and then really we like to kind of like zoom out and just to kind of like random like believe it or not like that makes so much sense to do by the way because this is exactly how the algorithm works when somebody finds something that they actually like i call it the dart system okay like they like a dartboard that's how i literally picture it we're like all facebook's trying to do their algo just hit the bullseye and as soon as they hit the bullseye yep they show you things that are the same categorically similar, and then it goes back to random again.
And then with random, what I basically do, I would call it like transforming. So like, believe it or not, the one niche that we love looking at the inspiration from is like the travel and like vegan niche. We personally - Vegan?
Like food? Because these vegan influencers, they're usually unemployed. you know, because they're busy eating tofu.
They don't have much. And they're like super passionate about like being activists about it. And so these are super creative.
And so sometimes there are these few creators who just like spawn out of nowhere. And then there are these creative ass hooks. And then we're like, oh, this is a sick hook.
How we could then go and proceed to introduce, you know, like. So to help with your ideation, you're essentially saying like, I'm just exposing myself to Kanye. Exactly.
that like loads my brain with things to think with for how I can use it in mine. And then I use that to go and see what's like one, what's already working from a topic perspective. Like, you know, what do I actually care?
Like the works, right? Like quite frankly, if I was in our space creating content, I was like, oh, doing like getting richer talks and talking about like the value of trees. It's clearly something that hits hard.
Yeah, it does.
So now that gives me context of like, oh, now I can stimulate my brain because my belief system is if I just need to create content, And I just have this blanket thing, this blank piece of paper with no structure, nothing. It's hard to come up with ideas, right?
Because most people aren't that creative. So you're trying to plug yourself into a framework that makes it like near effortless. Yes, where I actually have like almost like a little mini museum of like what good or what great looks like so that I can stimulate my brain.
So it's classic, like you're accumulating essentially like a swipe file of like creative inspiration. And for us, we didn't like to just not go, oh, let's make my own version of it. I like to tweak it around.
So as an example, there's one part where like everyone was leaving the US for some f***ing reason. There's this one particular guy, it's like some real estate dude who like now lives in Bali, like completely. And he makes a thing how like he's leaving the US despite making all of his money here and at the time he was beefing a client of ours actually and our clients like an immigrant works like as a cop so we're like dude this is a baller concept because all his customers are cops who at the time were getting hounded so we're like dude let's make a contrarian take on this.
We knew the topic would get attention and then with the exact contrarian because we had the research on it with a contrarian take that even though everyone's leaving I'm staying because I love the US I've been able to do all these different things. blew completely up because controversial topic contrarian take relevant to the icp yeah and so that's kind of what we do on the research we figure out what's currently working what's the narrative how can we add different takes into it or how can we feed the thing that we're delivering into the audience so as an example like we love politics over here you know and like as an example when when the current u .s president makes any form of like new law changes typically speaking there's obviously a trickle -down effect economically so back when the big beautiful bill came on We're like, dude, real estate is about to pop.
So we would literally use it as a headline and say, here's the generational opportunity. Use that as an ad headline for some clients and it ripped. And again, because now people are so sensitive to the news, they want to read what it means.
And then all of a sudden they're like, oh. You essentially took random content in that example that might not correlate at all to your niche and you correlated it. Exactly.
Because there was a tension on it. Exactly. Got it.
But then we make it relevant by tying it in. Yeah, you make it like something that actually makes sense. There's these creators out there, and I think it's the most stupid shit ever.
They just use these random stats or headlines of some random creator model making millions of dollars, and they try to tie it into like... YouTube automation, like makes no sense, no connection. We actually try to make logical arguments of like, hey, there's like a houses crisis coming up.
And, you know, then we structure the argument all the way to like, as a result of this housing crisis, here's why you should get into X, Y, Z opportunity. And so we try to like pick, find these angles and then creatively work into something either valuable or discoverable where we achieve our respective. Let me give you an example.
I'd be like for Jeremy AI, I'd be like, Trump just signed a new bill that renamed AI into SI. He's calling it super intelligence now. And he says in this tweet here that you're an enemy.
If you don't rename it, I'm going to stand my ground. I'm going to keep Jeremy AI named exactly what it is. I already bought the domain after all, you know, and I can take something random that might get attention.
I can correlate it to my thing and like, make people slightly aware about my thing. Exactly.
And maybe even riff on it a little bit and explain what it is. Now, like I said, we used to have an AI -based client. So we would go and say like, hey, you know, ChatGPT's codex is replacing video editors.
These are like five prompts that you can go and use. And then we'd give away the prompts and then we could go, but here's the crazy part. And then we would go and say, 99 % of businesses actually aren't using ChatGPT at all.
They would actually rather pay someone to execute it for them. If you can learn how to use these tools, you actually have a valuable skillset. you could sell for upwards of this much money.
And then that's how we kind of funneled them in and we drive the awareness where it's like, you know, you see, you take the random, you kind of provide the random value and then you layer it into like, hey, by the way. Tired of your AI model being a yes man and constantly agreeing with you. And then when you disagree, it all of a sudden disagrees with what it literally just said.
Here's three ways that you can get your AI to stop being a yes man. general point number one that actually gets it to stop, general point number two that gets it to stop, general point number three, integrate Jeremy AI via the MCP into it. And then you get two AI models arguing with each other in real time.
Comment AI if you want access to Jeremy AI now. You like that? Yeah.
We actually drive like interest into like a topic and then we somehow manage to like layer it in. So like random thing, satiate technically that you're talking about said random thing a little longer. before you tie it into your thing.
Exactly. And then like towards like, what do you think? Like the last one third of the video tied into your thing?
Yeah, we sometimes go like the second half, like two thirds. I say a random thing. We always try to keep it like ICP relevant.
So like selling to like a real estate investor, we never talk about gardening. Makes sense. Back to the concept of ideation.
So this is a great way to be able to think and flow. A lot of people that I talk to, there's a lot of Jeremy's Inner Circle members, as an example, where they can't do anything unless they have some kind of teleprompter in front of them that's telling them what to do. Every time my staff literally has ever told me, oh, let's go teleprompter, I'm like, I'm about to fire you, dog.
We don't do that. What do you actually tell people to do in terms of ideation? Are you building out an actual script you want your clients to say?
And if you are in that example, are you feeding it to them through a teleprompter? Are you just giving them bullet points? Like, what's your structure there?
We would say, obviously, based on, like, if we do a B -roll -based drill, which we covered earlier, we just script the whole thing. If from carousels, like, I think it's just more like... Yeah, because then it'd just be text with the B -roll.
Like, typically speaking, like, so there's two stages. There's the idea and there's the execution. From idea, we, again, we just do the framework of, like, what's working and what's trending versus what can I deliver value on.
That's how we usually come up with the ideas. Makes sense. Once we then have the actual idea, this is where the fun begins, right?
Most people don't care to think that much and they don't understand. it yeah what we didn't do is we call it framing okay like you're very familiar with that concept we think about how do we now frame the concept in a way where it achieves our accomplishment meaning that how do we get people to become aware of us educate them you know ultimately sell them yeah and so that's usually what we do and then from there we just kind of have like a little you can call it whether it's a storyboard or whether it's like an actual like outline because again it's kind of like you chart it out okay cool hook i'm gonna do this then i'm gonna add a bit of context to maintain attention then i deliver my main point or like I build up to the main point, deliver it, call to action.
And then that in of itself, we would go and say, hey, make sure we say this, this, this, this. We would just bullet point it out roughly. And then I don't believe in fully scripting and you just like saying it like verbatim because there's going to be differences in how I would articulate myself versus you.
Agree. So we just do like the outline realistically of it. And then what we usually like to do.
is we just to kind of like to, I would say it's like compare it to greatness, right? I'm a big believer that like when stuff works, there's specific recipes for it. And so we have obviously a swipe final attorney of like what's really working, what's ripping.
And so we like to compare it. Like, does it have like certain like flows or like little maybe re -hooks that are proven to go and work? So we, even through the outline, are able to ensure that there's like a baseline performance being hit, which isn't always the case, but just gives us a higher likelihood to succeed.
That little flow. especially on like a, you know, if you're trying to go a bit broader and reach more people, you are really ultimately able to scale your, like how many people you convert. How much time?
If we wanted to go really gnarly with it, right? You want to go write a piece of content that can get millions of views and get a few things. This might take you like, you know, an hour or two.
Per reel? On a reel, maybe less, but like on like a carousel as an example, you know, that can take you like two hours plus. So as an example, if you're encouraging a person to essentially do one a day, they're putting an hour a day.
Yeah, I'd say an hour. And let's say I would rather go and say too much and say maybe you spend an hour and a half on it. Got it.
But then again, to me, and we'll get to this into the later part, what's the best one hour and a half you can invest? Because we have - I feel like dollar value per hour would be high. Really high.
Because with some of the scaling strategies that we've now found as well, you can go and get tens of thousands of leads from that one fucking reel. You encourage people to do it themselves or you encourage people to have somebody that just does it for you and your staff or what? I run a marketing agency, so this is going to be very incongruent.
But I actually think a lot of people should learn it themselves. Yeah, got it. We see this in our deals.
The best clients that we have, they actually don't really give a fuck about having a personal brand. It's not like they're a number one asset. best clients, which ultimately left, they actually had an interest.
So they would actually like work with us in unison on like scripting, like ideation and stuff like that. But like having it as a skill is so valuable because you know, when these guys start running ads, dude, it's a f***ing banger. These people are all sitting here learning from us right now.
So I'm sure they agree too. Let me show you my half of the ideation cycle. Okay.
When I wanted to come up with an idea, right? Usually at that point, I'm like, I'm ready to film. Okay.
And it's a particular day, probably like initially when I first started, it was usually a Sunday. Nowadays, I have Tuesday and I have Thursday set aside, dedicated just to filming stuff because I film for a lot longer now. When I would sit down and I'm like, I'm ready to go.
Like now I'm ready to film. I usually just sit there. I'll kind of shoot the shit with Jay behind the scenes.
I'm extroverted. I'll process thoughts out loud. And I'll be like, all right, man.
So like, here's some stuff all my people were dealing with this week. And my ideas would exclusively originate. from the people that I'm actively talking to that are already clients of mine or already Jeremy's Inner Circle members or like already a certain person that I have exposure to and that I can see.
And then because I talk to so many of them week over week, I get to see patterns that they're all dealing with. Like as an example, the weekly Inner Circle group calls for Jeremy's Inner Circle are always just, here's a collective pattern y 'all are all dealing with at once that you're trying to get information for that you guys don't even realize you're all collectively dealing with at once because you're DMing me about it.
And then I'll make a video on it that collectively benefits everybody. And naturally, the problems accelerate to the next problem. I've never found an instance where the problems go away.
I've found that no matter what, my people still need me. and the problems advance as time goes on. Now, you might come in the middle of your journey and be at a different stage than where the content's currently at in the problems that we're helping people solve, but that's okay.
You may just be more applicable to watch one of the older videos that covers one of those specific problems that you're dealing with. Most of my videos... That I drop if not almost all my videos that I drop are purely based on like that exact perspective my ideation Occasionally comes from something where I see a piece of content that I just think again It's like kind of what you said about the random content like the castle guy or just recently I've had a float of people just copying my shit.
So as a result of being copied so much and you get copycatted too as an original thinker, I'm sure this resonates with you. I thought to myself, I'm like, all right, what can I do that would be even more unique than what I already do? So I have a lower probability of being copied, right?
And so that can sometimes inspire an idea that I may execute on. But I'm going to tell you like probably 98 % of what I'm actually doing is just I'm actively thinking with. what are clients dealing with?
So let me slightly, I don't want to say challenge, but I think it's just like, to me, it's a comparison. You obviously work with like a very specific, you know, individual, right? And you interact with them a lot, right?
Yeah. So I think naturally what you're doing with this flow is the exact same as here. Yeah.
Because... What I'm doing is I basically look at what do the ideal customers currently chip at and complain about. I just do it by consuming what they already engage with, which tells me everything.
And we look at comments. It is technically one and the same, just a different approach. That's a fair point.
So at this point, what I then do is... is I film. I sit down and I make it like an easy format for me to plug into in terms of the ideation.
So for me, it's usually just videos just like this. We don't struggle at all. Like none of what we're sitting here saying right now is scripted.
We spent a few minutes prior to this just saying like, all right, here's the flow of what we're going to go through and teach people. That's literally all I do on my ideation side of the equation. On reels, what we do is, is we'll sit down and we'll pull data.
So I have my guys. that come to me and tell me like, all right, it's time to film reels. Like, here's the ideas that we're gonna execute on.
They'll just pull from the exact same logic. Jeremy AI users, Jeremy's inner circle members, master internet marketing members. And they'll look at the questions that came up.
They'll look at the patterns that came up. They'll also look at the consumption and they'll look at what people are actually using and doing. And then from there, we'll be like, here's what we do.
And then I will say on their side of things, when I go film reels, when the idea is presented to me, it's a different flow. Like in this flow specifically, when I'm like, all right, it's time to film. We got to come up with an idea, okay?
Let's look at what the clients are actively dealing with. Okay, that's the pattern. It's clear as day.
I'm going to go film now. When I get the reels, the flow is, okay, I sit down and I'm ready to film. I'm presented an idea.
that I need to like think about in real time. And there's a lot tighter of a window to like conceptualize and articulate myself for what I'm actually trying to say. And then I film it.
And I feel like a lot of those come out like shit and I have a lower hit rate. To your point, you're putting an hour per reel at the higher end of the spectrum here into each reel that you film. Because we just feel intention is so big.
And what you're saying is like, because we consume so much content. we understand like frameworks and what successful look like. So when you said about the Q4, so my thing is like, I know frameworks, for example, that works like statistics and numbers always works well, right?
So like I would, for example, if I was made a real owner, I would say like, hey, you know, in the next three months, the average US business is about to go spend this much money on paid advertising. But here's what most people don't understand. Because there's limited supply of like ads that can be shown, that means ad costs are about to go and rise.
What most people then do is like they do this. below that, here's three ways to fix it. And so you see, internally, I then just take the format and we plug it into frameworks that we know are proven to go and work.
Dude, that's really good. You do it because you know ads and I think you're a really good communicator. I just recommend the scripting part because I think the average person is really poor at communicating and expressing themselves.
The flow that you're talking about is a very good flow. And to be rather direct with you, I have... I don't feel in any way, shape, or form on the short form side of things nearly up to par with how I could be and how I will be in the near future.
I'm going to be a dog at that specific skill here soon enough. But I will say it's like a completely different brain. to operate on the long form side versus the short form side.
Back to my point is like there's prep time for them in those videos. There's not a lot of prep time in my video execution, but they've still seemingly done well. I wonder how well they do if I did prep.
Anything else on ideation? Nope, that's it. I think the biggest thing, sorry, the biggest thing I'll say is we like to over time find winners and double down on them.
That's the biggest thing. It's like once you post 100, 200 plus pieces of content, you should spot patterns. Like if you don't spot patterns, then like...
Good luck. If you don't understand, hey, this works, or generally speaking, if I talk about these specific topics, the audience get triggered. Because then if you have lower view rates, we know which topics or which triggers we can go back to to instantly go and juice up the performance.
I think having that pattern recognition makes ideation a lot easier. All right, we got a good amount of stuff here to go through. Let's crack into lead gen next.
So the entire platform that you consistently exploit is Instagram. And your version of lead gen. It's mainly to my understanding, getting people to comment things or DM certain words.
Yeah, 100%. And then you just have setters work them and you turn them into set calls. Quick, I'll explain this in a very quick way.
So the whole premise is like most people, they think I'm going to put it into like a traditional funnel. Instagram hates when you immediately take them off the channel. The Instagram's model is that they make revenue from showing you ads.
If you take people off the platform, you and Instagram aren't aligned. We want to be as aligned as possible with the platform. So what we typically go and do is we have like our content over here.
one or two ctas either we just sell hey dm us a keyword right and like very direct response hey if you want to learn how to do xyz business model dm me the keyword and we'll chat yeah boom this is like highest intent leads or this is a more like unaware content we might just do like comment this keyword and we'll send you a specific resource bang and so this essentially what happens is here we send them to like a lead magnet which is inside of the DMs.
And typically speaking, we start the conversation first before we send them the lead magnet. So the session time that they have with us is longer, which means Instagram doesn't feel like cheated per se. And then if they go off, it's Instagram compliant.
If they DM us here, we literally just focus on having a DM -based conversation. So somebody DMs versus somebody comments a certain word. When they comment a certain word, they're still moving to the DMs.
They're still moving into the DMs, but then they eventually get pushed to a lead magnet. And versus if you tell them to DM you, you're not pushing them to a lead magnet? No.
You're going to keep them in a conversation. It's a direct response conversation where like they now say, hey, I want to learn. The reason is like this is more high intent and these are probably more people who already consumed a bunch of content.
This is like lower intent and they're still like in kind of like the discovery or like phase. Yeah, so you send them free shit. And so then what we do is two things.
One, this with comments ETAs because of like Instagram tech and whatever. We use ManyChat for all of this, by the way. But this has like a lower open rate, which is naturally because people are less aware and they might not follow you.
This has a much higher open and response rate because obviously people are a lot more like sophisticated. And so by mixing those two, we can combine both quality and quantity. Interesting, interesting variation there.
I've always optimized around the comment when I'm on Instagram. And I get people in the DMs. And then I always use mini chat to like send them something.
Most of the time it's either like a straight up sales page or a lead magnet or a piece of content. We'll rotate a lot of stuff. Or obviously YouTube video.
This is great. We'll send them YouTube content. We'll send them lead magnets.
We'll send so much free stuff. But occasionally we'll just straight up spam a, yo, go to the sales page. And we actually see a pretty good conversion from that, believe it or not.
But to your point, that's very interesting to interpret DMs as. higher intent. We just found that to be frank.
Just the ability to have a conversation within the platform itself. Yeah, but it's also how we frame the call to action. And we just found they already have a higher response rate.
And if we already make a direct response call to action, like, hey, if you want to learn this system or like start this opportunity, like DM us because then the response thing is a lot easier. That makes a lot of sense. That's very interesting.
The cool thing, which is like something we've realized recently. Because of AI and the whole, I would say, bit saturation of it, people, especially when you post it on Facebook, which is obviously just cross -posting from Instagram to Facebook, people are a lot more skeptical to respond. Like Facebook.
Yeah. Is that sometimes on lead magnets? It doesn't really feel like a platform for that.
We literally just go and say, we use Manichat to go and say, hey, by the way, what email do you want me to send the lead magnet to? And then we say, cool, give me your phone number and I'll send it to you. And then essentially, basically like a lead form through Manichat.
Yeah. That recently has shown tremendous increases. So you'll say, you'll say, comment this word.
When they comment the word, they get a DM that says, hey, shoot me your email and I'll shoot it over to you. They respond with their email. Then you also then follow up and say, give me your cell phone too.
Yeah. Hey, what email do I send it to? They're cool.
It's like, hey, I have this extra thing. What's the best number to send it to you? Then they send it.
It's like two minutes out there, but the phone number is like ring -ding -ding. Yeah, I bet. But also, this goes to a principle that we've actually taken from you, which was like the level of interest spectrum.
Yeah. At the time when they reach out, it's an emotional trigger that you respond to. Yeah, there's a high probability that they're most interested at that moment.
And again, you've got to react onto that. Interest declines as time passes. This has been great because now they have a decent chat time on the phone.
Which means they actually go and have a high probability to like have some form of investment, which means after the call, when we send the nurture assets, they actually watch the show up on the call with some form of like intent. That makes sense. So those are the two ways that we usually right now, like this is my, I go, I go almost every post.
I go, okay, comment something. They comment something and I send them a lead magnet or I send them a YouTube video or. I just straight up send them a sales page, you know, and that's the end of that on Instagram.
And then when they ask dumb questions, they get their asses blocked. Oh yeah, I do. I literally just hired a setter in person to like sit in the office all day and like work leads.
And when I sit there and I look at some of these DMs, it's like, to your point, it's actually kind of surprising that aligns that well. The comment people usually are like more short and like they're less responsive overall. But the people who specifically opt in, way more willingness to communicate because the thing that they've opted into, it's almost like they moved from skepticism to, oh, like this is actually good.
I feel like there's gotta be a lot of people churning out terrible lead magnets or just terrible videos. Because these people, when they comment these words, like there's like little to no enthusiasm, but then right after the consumption actually occurred, like, do we have this one? It's a Jeremy AI scaling plan.
No cost. You fill out like 20 questions. You get an email like this long and it is.
It's so valuable. Like every time we see somebody that actually fills it out and they read it, they always come back, like literally 10 out of 10 come back to us and they say things like, holy shit, that was insane. Like that was actually super valuable.
I'm gonna go execute on this now. We found that one of our highest churn reasons with Jeremy AI was people would want like some one -off thing, like just a scaling plan as an example. So we just turn it into a lead magnet.
Once they have officially done it and consumed the thing that we're giving away, that's specifically when we follow up. And we, it's, it's after this that we push people to a setter where we then try to push them over to a sales call. Yeah.
That's our flow. And we wait. And if we see, cause we can see it.
If they're, if, if they comment the word, they get a DM from us. We usually do a double opt -in and mini chat where we're like, Hey, you got to press this button to get the thing. And then if they say, okay, I pressed the button, right?
The thing fires off to them officially. And then they go to the page where they can get said thing. If they take that action, and again, the consumption occurs, they'll come back and they'll be like, that was fucking nuts, dude.
Like, wow. But we send a follow -up message with ManyChat after the thing is officially sent that follows up and says like, hey, let me know your thoughts after you check it out to try to encourage letting us know if they actually consumed it. And those are the only people we follow up with.
On YouTube, my version of lead gen is just telling people, by the way, this would be way easier if you just use Jeremy Ayotte. There's a link for it down in the description and you could get signed up. It's the most cost -effective thing you'll ever do.
By the way, it's an agent. It can do things for you. So instead of having to sit here and literally learn all this top to bottom, you could learn it all, which is good because that's going to help you to prompt it better.
But then a lot of this, like think about the employment cost that it takes to actually execute on most of this. It's a lot. And for you to do it yourself, I mean, some of this takes an hour a post is what he's saying.
You have Jeremy AI do it, it'd be a hell of a lot easier. Or I say, dude, if you're a rich person and you're trying to get a hell of a lot richer, it's Jeremy's inner circle. Look, there's multiple Jeremy's in it.
He's been a part of it for a long time. It's as real as it gets in there. We got a mastermind this weekend.
Jeremy flew in from Switzerland. We got people that fly in from Australia. Dubai boys fly out.
We got South Americans that don't even speak English that come here with AirPods in from how valuable the information is that we disseminate in those masterminds. One -on -one calls, weekly group calls. If you're rich trying to get a hell of a lot richer, link down in the description.
And I pepper in like that in my YouTube videos. That's my version of lead gen there. And I'll usually do it like towards like the first one third of the video, usually towards like the last one third of the video.
I'll pepper it in usually more than once. And I usually pepper in at the most random time too. Like while I'm in the middle of some, like I'll be in the middle of flowing and I'll be like, and by the way, this is why, then I'll pepper in the CTA.
And I've always been told by other people like, oh, your CTA should be short. They all make less money than me now. So it's like, well, I'll pitch all the time because that's why I'm making content.
I'm making content to make money. It's like the reasons that you and I are here right now helping people with this is because you're going to turn around and use it and do something with it. And then you'll come back and buy stuff from us because you realize, wow, these guys are actually the shit.
Like they really know what they're talking about. Imagine what their paid stuff has. And you'd be right to think that because the page is awesome.
So anyway, that's the whole point that I've always found when it comes. Anything else on lead gen? No, what we usually have is like, we have just the typical, what we like to do, which is like slightly ninja, is when we have like.
we're aware that most people discover us based on like the profile. So like they see on the profile. So we like to optimize the profile for lead gen.
The way we do that is fairly simple. Obviously you have like your Instagram profile. Usually the third line, we have like a CTA for like a valuable resource.
That's one. And then two, what we have is two layers. So layer one is like the actual like story highlights.
So we like to go and have like, I just call it MS, like my story. Just story, transformation, you know, the good old. Second one would basically go and be like behind the scenes.
The behind the scenes very strategically is like literally just like stuff from the thing that you're doing, which like should sell people onto your vehicle or opportunity. Like demonstrating that you're doing the shit you're talking about. Like showing results, like you're doing the thing, just kind of creating interest.
And then last thing would just be like case studies slash student wins. Again, all of those strategically have CTAs. You might even throw in one that's like a Q &A type thing where like makes a ton of sense.
The second layer that we have is essentially like pin posts, right? There's three. specific posts that are actually just optimized around addressing objections or awareness questions.
So this is really to go and suss us out. And this, believe it or not, help us drive upwards of like a thousand leads a month for clients. These are your pin posts?
Yeah, pin posts. Your pin posts are objection handlers? Like objection handlers, introduction based stuff.
So for example, one might just break down like a result that the client's accomplished just to go and populate the business model. One might just be like, as example, in the real estate space, there's a lot of skepticism. We might just be like, the landlord will never let you rent out his property.
And then it's just like freaking flexing. them yeah and then the last one might just be like a client case study or like something else you know just like and that really works well because it's like when people come into the profile they might follow you like they have questions popping up like what the do i need to know to actually have sort of interest so we want to again act on their level of interest and then feed them the information that is more probable to turn them into a potential lead makes a ton of sense okay next one we've got is the conversion itself so at the step of conversion what are we doing to help these folks So for us, we do DM setting.
That's like what I think on Instagram specifically, super crucial. The way we perceive that is through simple Instagram conversations. So if they're in the DMs, right, the average person, the average human being that just interacts, all that they're thinking is like, hey.
They don't know they're speaking to like an actual setter. They think they speak to a real human. And so we have three goals.
Wherever we want to go and go through DMs, we have three particular goals. We want to sell the individual on three things. We want to sell them on the guy, aka the creator.
I want you as like, let's say, if you were the average individual and coming into DMs off of my post, I want you to be sold on me as an individual, aka, hey, Jeremy is the guy. He can actually go and help me. right solve whatever problem that is to have i want to sell them on that the second thing is i want to sell them on the vehicle so as an example i want them to go and verbally say that oh yeah i believe in vending machines being a great business model or i believe in like pinballs being a great like investment right and the last thing is i want to i want them to be sold on their ability the biggest thing that i see is like essentially when it's tied to show rates people don't actually believe that they're a guy the vehicle and their ability yep These three things, this is setter best practices.
This is setter best practice. These are the three things we want to, during a conversation, people to almost like affirm to us and like kind of give out. And this is not automated.
This is not automated. These are human beings. Yep.
How many total messages do you think are accumulated in this period of time? It's a seven to nine step process. So I would say anywhere between 12 to 15 plus.
Some of them get really deep because people will just go and tell their entire life story and basically tell you how they hit their lives, which is sad enough itself, but amazing because by the time they get onto the call, they are going to go and say, oh, X, Y, Z told me that you have these problems. They're like, oh, you know, they have so much context.
But it makes sense. We get all the pain, poise and desires by getting them sold on those three things. How many people out of the ones that comment or DM make it from here?
to the point of i'm gonna get on a call okay so i'm gonna break this down for you so let's say the hypothetical scenario that we get 10 000 new inbound conversations what we realize is like usually it used to be like 80 90 response because of like these creator motherfuckers making content on how many chat works the response rate has been gradually going down so right now we're seeing that like 60 of people actually open and respond to the initial message which will take us down to 6 000 Off of those, our intention is for at least 10 % of those 6 ,000 to essentially get into an actual sales call.
So 10 ,000 people comment and like technically start the DM. Yep. this amount of people respond back to the first DM.
Typically average, yeah. And then 600 of these people, 10 % are going to get onto a sales call. Yep.
And that's when you actually have the conversions that then again, you need good speed to lead. You need setters who aren't donkeys. You need actual best practices and like what resources to send, what nurse to send.
And this process might take like 24 to 48 hours, give or take at times. But again, by the time that they actually... get re -engaged in a conversation.
They've consumed two, three hours worth of material, which means when they book a call, they're not just some like randos who are like, oh, I've seen you sometimes. They're people who know you by name and what it is you do and might not even know where you freaking live. Where are the setters from?
Like where are you hiring these setters? I don't like to have biases, but we like to have UK or US based. I personally, because I live there, I prefer the UK quite a bit because they have like a lesser standard.
They have a much higher work ethic. And life in the UK, if you live in the wrong city, can be pretty miserable. So like a very, very high desire to actually make something out of themselves.
Most importantly, we need people who have EQ, emotional intelligence, right? Most people, when you take them from like a third world country, unfortunately, they just lack that ability and they lack cultural awareness. So like a good example is we used to have this client who had like an opportunity around Amazon brands.
And he's pretty like... high test alpha person. And so like people would like one word him and almost trying to cheat check him.
And so like the setters were trained on it to go and say like, yo, do you want to stay poor? Or you want to give me like real good answers? And like, they'll be like, oh, this is actually you.
And so then they would really open up. But if you have a low EQ person, they're going to miss such cues. They're not going to be able to jump on like key steps.
So it's just sales 101 that you've got to have some form of understanding of. Do you find that there's like a limitation to the quantity of setters that you can have before the whole system breaks? We right now on a particular client account have like seven setters.
are actively working. Seven setters, it's a mixture of outbound as well. I find a lot of these people, they're going to struggle if they have like three setters.
And most of the time above that, it starts to break. Is there like a different system you implement at the beginning versus at the end? It's a management issue, in my opinion.
It's like a sales team management. Yeah, but it's an example, right? I think you actually mentioned this, where it's like you want people that are self -managing.
In the onboarding, we check the f*** out of people. And like we would churn them hard. So it's like when we call it the elite setter doctrine.
So like by the time they're through it, they're like, I'm not going to be a... I'm not going to ask dumb questions. I'm going to be self -sufficient in like finding the resources.
And if I come with a problem, I already have solutions lined up. That in of itself. And then if you see the team culture built properly, they're not going to be stupid because they know like the moment someone around on a bigger team, right?
We should reroute their lead flow to someone else. Yeah, makes sense. They're like, where's my leads at?
It's like, yeah, no, Johnny took them over here. Tool -wise. Business Manichat.
Straight out of mini chat. Straight out of mini chat and then if we get to a point where we have like two, three, five hundred leads a day coming in consistently, we would then go and actually deploy one or two setters, I prefer one, into the actual account just to do like strategic outbound if need be as well as strategic follow -ups.
On that though, right now it's not something I... like at the time of this recording it's just because like instagram can be funny so like if you're gonna say dude if you give out a login to some random dude in a different country that's going to access your profile or even if they're in the same country but in a different place than you like that could flag your account we've been fairly consistent and successful with Like VPNs and stuff like that.
We've never really had big issues again, right? Most of our team members are based in Europe Most of our clients are based in the US do I tell people the opposite haven't don't you dare you haven't seen an issue? But there's obviously always donkeys which you know, it's probably not you watching But if you then just do some random you have like someone from Bangalore India logging in like yes They will do that.
There are a few of them that will for sure do that Okay from the idea of the conversion you're doing DM setting. Yep Again, you have this like essentially nine to 12 step DM process that you're putting people through.
Expectation wise, you get 10 ,000 people that DM or comment, 6 ,000 of them even open the first message. You get 40 % drop off literally right there. 10 % of those people are gonna go book a call.
That's your expectation. That's it. Okay.
And then what I do, if we have a client that's like, for example, they're really successful with a webinar and like their webinar conversions crush, but their sales team can't handle DM leads, which believe it or not, that actually happens these days. Right here at the 6 ,000, you'd probably push them straight. So then we just literally just push the open.
We just push straight to the webinar. Yeah, it makes sense. And then all that the setters do is they then repush them to the webinar.
Makes total sense. And so like, even if we now realize if a client is good at webinars and DMs, if we see someone's more skeptical, we just route them straight to the webinar if the webinar is within 24 to 48 hours of the conversation happening. And that makes a lot of sense.
My version of a conversion is just doing a sales call. That's it. We tell people on the DM side, like we just talked about, like what the flow is there, push into a sales call.
On YouTube, doesn't matter which one of the products it is. Every product down there in that link in the description is a call funnel application. It's a sales call.
Pretty much any funnel on YouTube is going to work because of the content. It's long form content. So there's a very high probability that no matter what you put in the description, they're going to click and there's going to be a high conversion rate on that.
But for us, we specifically want to vet against the wrong people buying our shit. That's a huge part about how we optimize around longevity on my side. So it's always going to be a sales call because we always want to manage the people that are actively coming through the process.
Nothing else on conversions? No. Okay.
Now, you specifically have a system when it comes to data tracking. And this is going to be quite interesting because a lot of people struggle immensely with any ability at all to track what happens organically. Of course, you've got UTMs that you can put on links for all these different funnel types that you've got spread across all these different organic sources.
But are you claiming that you can track the individual piece of content? We are capable of tracking. the revenue coming as well as calls and leads from a specific piece of content.
And from there, we're able to then go and scale that in the scaling section to go and actually drive significantly more traffic. My bet would be it has something to do with the comments. Yes.
So what we essentially do, this is very in Lehman's terms, there's a particular tool that we use as well, which is kind of cool, but essentially put at the end of each content piece, we have call to actions. What we like to do is what I would call a contextual uh cta so contextual c2a is like if we make a video around like let's say the word big beautiful bill we would say hey comment the word bill and i'll send you a keyword right now inside of many chat and like in the com in complication with like one or two like zaps yeah you can essentially like every time somebody newly subscribes or an old subscriber that returns back with a keyword you can essentially go and track what keyword they used and then if you set it up in a specific way it can actually track it to a specific post so now when they end up inside of the dms right they're almost flagged to the specific keyword that makes so much sense so somebody comments a specific word Is it an AI tool that's specifically going through mini -chat or is it mini -chat itself?
No, mini -chat itself, but it gets better. Got it. The problem would then be if you then go and book a call, so this is where most people lose it, right?
So when you go for a call booking, yes, you have UTM, but now which conversation does it come from? You wouldn't know, right? Wouldn't you technically know, though, because they DMed a particular word?
Well, yeah, but a keyword. But how do you now know which of the 3 ,000 people that DMed you are actually good balls booking a call? Well, I guess unless they gave some kind of like signaling piece of information in the chat, that'd probably be the only way, right?
No. So inside of ManyChat, they have what's called a ManyChat chat ID. So this is essentially like your unique identifier.
You passed the chat ID to the call booking page in the UTM somehow. So one of our tech guys, shout out Mr. Plum, and he's a little cooked Eastern European.
He found a way. to essentially have an automation that when they send the call booking link, it's like the setter just presses a button, call booking. Dynamic UTM.
It grabs the chat ID, attaches it at the end of the call booking link, sends it in. And then when it comes back in like our internal tracking system, it then flags, it actually attaches the ManyChat chat ID. Smart.
You probably have a hidden field in the form on the call booking step that accepts the chat ID from the UTM automatically. And now we're able to track which person booked a call. We're able to backtrack what was the first keyword that they got outreach to?
What was the keyword that led to them ultimately booking a call? Yeah. which setter booked them, what was the time between outreach and booking, which gives us the chat window, like how long it takes them to actually book a call.
And so now we're able to track all of that data. Obviously from there, once we do the basic UTM tracking or whatever basic tracking as well, if they have the call, as well as the payments ultimately, we're now to go and able to link back. how much we're making per post, per post.
You've probably seen some posts that get like a substantial amount of DMs that do next to nothing. And you probably see some that do next to nothing. We had this one post that got 30 million views, right?
Talking about like a guy that left from the UK to Dubai. We're like, dude, there's going to be so much money. We made the rookie error of like not tying it into his business vehicle.
So he had like 200 people that are like, dude, do you have relocation services to Dubai? It sucked. Yeah, vice versa.
We made some random video on like some guys like our financial decision. Still did decently well, but they did like, I think close to like the seven, 800 grand a month mark. Yeah.
Just incredible. And still until this day, we get sales from that post because obviously we put it as a pin post. Yeah.
This, the tracking is one thing. The real reason I like to call it like the data tracking side is because it gives you like different levels of insights. Yeah.
Right. To me, it allows me to go and say which content rips and that allows me to then have scaling strategies deployed. But more importantly, it allows me to really figure out ideation.
What do I need to double down on? Yeah, because which ones actually makes revenue versus which one gets views and down. And then the second insight that we like to use, because it's like at the end of the day, I want two things, right?
I want to grow the audience and I want to get sales. So inside of Instagram, if you go into insights, like if you go inside of, if you go into Instagram, you basically go like settings. Yeah.
Right. And then you go like insights. You can go and filter the performance based on filter by by new followers.
Right. That's the second feature that we like to use, because if we actually go and do that, then we can go and see which post is actually good at driving new followers in, which that then allows us to say, oh, this is actually great for like awareness piece of content. And so later on, if we want to go and deploy scaling strategies.
to optimize for audience growth, those are the kind of strategies that we're actually gonna go lift up. That makes so much sense. This might sound a little silly.
My version of tracking is to not track. On the organic side, I feel like it interferes with ideation so much. Because as an example, like anytime I get somebody that's helping us on the organic side with something, they'll be like, oh dude, these have been your top videos.
Like we technically track to be clear. Like we have UTMs, we have unique links. Like we have visibility as to what does the revenue and what doesn't.
Like what ideas specifically are working to drive the revenue. We have an idea of what drives awareness versus eventually leads to revenue. You know, like we're very cognizant of that stuff.
But when I say like we don't track, I mean in the sense that I don't really make my decisions from a place. what actually works or what doesn't work from a revenue perspective because they all tie together like in my specific world I've noticed that if I only optimized as an example around the videos that made the money my Performance would actually drop in spamming the videos that made money perpetually because what actually made the videos work that made the money in most instances to your point that we originally discussed was there they followed like a sequence of some other kind of information path that somebody went down so i don't try to make the decisions about the content relative to what drove the money i make the decisions from a place of Okay, what do I need to do to nurture my audience?
What do I need to do? I make call to actions in every video anyway. Occasional videos, as I mentioned in my more recent strategy, will optimize around awareness, but we know they all play into each other.
We just like it for an insight, so we better understand the audience while on Instagram and on YouTube. You need to track and you need the awareness. Okay, the next thing that we need to talk about to wrap this thing up for these folks, we have audience growth, what to do if it's not working, and then optimize for longevity.
So when it comes to audience growth, you consistently... are maximizing the amount of views that you're getting because you're spamming the awareness consistently. Yes.
Right? I've only just recently done this. Just recently as in maybe at best like three months from the time we're sitting here filming this right now, have I really given a f*** about how do I generate new viewers and not just the same viewers I've already got.
And so when I do that, I dedicate one video a week on my YouTube out of the four that I post per week. That's like an awareness optimized video. Could be something like a get richer talk.
Could be something like just a broader topic that we know naturally gets more views. On Instagram specifically, I don't do it as intentionally as I'm sure you will do. But you have a specific system, I'm sure, that relates to audience growth.
I think I mentioned earlier, I like betting on winning horses. And so the organic layer that we just worked through with the data tracking, that gives me like, what are my outliers? What are the winners?
What actually makes money? Because that's what I give a f*** about. Agree.
And so let's assume we post like a bunch of pieces of content, right? We post like a bunch of content and like, you know, some of it makes money. And then over time, we actually go and realize like, oh, this particular one here or these two videos, they actually make the most amount of money.
Well, the problem that most, you know, paid marketers that hate organic for some reason, they will say like, well, you go viral, then you start over again. Wrong. What we then do is we immediately realize, hey, these pieces of content work.
Let's amplify the fuck out of them, right? Because that's what organic is. You get organic sentiment, you scale it up.
So the way we do is like different levers, right? So lever one would essentially - Yeah, I think I know where you're going with this. This makes a lot of sense.
So we do what's called collabs and shout outs. So shout outs, like these like theme pages, right? And we own this for anyone who claims it's done is we've actually invented this and run it for like six years.
So thank you very much. Long story short, Colabs and shout outs, like you buy these theme pages who are like niche specific. So business, health, psychology, whatever.
And they basically say like, you know, nice people but they're not very business savvy they charge like pennies on the dollars for the awareness yeah and if you do your job in the content messaging side you actually acquire really qualified views or like profile visits for like pennies on the dollars yeah makes sense so that's level one how we immediately scale again we spend anywhere on this on a monthly basis like 4k on the low end where we just boost the best performing content pieces all the way up to as much as like you know i think for some clients we spend like 50 grand a month well you know but like At that point, obviously, we're talking about hitting potential seven -figure months.
But essentially, that's just a good way to scale up the impressions that you're getting and kind of ultimately work in your content. So you'll take the same pieces of content that already did well on your page and you'll have them reposted or reshared. On their feet.
either. So if they do collabs, they just join on as a collaborator and then their feed sees our original content. And then that's for like, what, like a certain period of time and you disconnect it?
Yeah. So if we, within 24, 48 hours, essentially, like if we see the performance really well, we add it on. Then if we see the, again, that's when you can do basic cost per lead calculations.
Got it. For us, anything below $10, we're like, yeah, just ramp it up. Got it.
That's level one. Shout outs, they post it on their actual feeds and then they just drive the distribution towards your profile. That's how you grow the audience.
Level two is trial reels. Now to all the content experts out there, apologies for about to go and say, but testing trial reels to like see what works is the number one way to actually get your account. So most people use trials to go and say, oh, I have this reel.
Let me just ask five different hooks. It's not what we do. Instagram doesn't like to be like you know a little that basically just gets like you know spanked around with all this they want qualitative content so like very simply put what we do is like we're like hey this is a banger let me go and put it in different variations or shapes on it yeah so we have a piece of content but we then do is we create different variations so some of it might just be like if we have a talking head reel we might just do like a b -roll based reel out of it very simple like you know transformation of like format right or we might just do like saturation is one way to change speed you know like font just small editing changes and then because we know it's already proven to resonate with the right audience hopefully we then just post it in a different form or with different speed different music different style in at least three to four different ways This allows us to get have a real that gets you know a million or two million views and gets X amount of conversions to almost like Triple or quadruple the effect that it gets.
Yeah, because again, you just it's what they used to do on clipping pages I'm just like these massive different niches. Yeah, like Kate and like, you know, like Bell Luke Belmar would do okay You just do that in your own way and it works because then after a few weeks You can just go and recycle the whole thing on the winners again.
Yeah, which is awesome. That's great Now, lever number three, this is where we probably get more into your domain.
Layer number one, I will go and say, this is just like more for like lead generation. Once we realize like, hey, we've had organic success, we've ran the collab, maximized how much we can regally squeeze out of it. And we've done the trial real stuff.
It's like, we know this is proven. Well, how can we squeeze it? We've recently, and I go and say this very clear, we've just taken these like best performing content pieces and we literally did like your ad strategy.
Oh, yeah. All that we do is we literally take like 10 pieces and I say this because I have like no clue. Which one?
Like the hammer them strategy or something? No, it's like a DM ad. We literally just go and basically take 10 pieces of content and all that we do is we do one campaign and like three ad sets.
That's literally all we do, by the way. It's like very bare bones. Like obviously what's being targeted in the ad sets.
One is like a 1 % lookalike. So it's core audiences. Yeah.
Okay, yeah. And then one is like an interest stack. Yeah.
And then one is like completely broad. Yeah, makes sense. And so then what we're like now we - And then you put the same 10 pieces of content within each one of those ad sets.
And then this, like this. Because we obviously on the back end of this, we then pixel optimize it with like not your typical like, oh, I just got his lead because then obviously you get a bunch of poor people in. We optimize it around how can we go and get qualified leads that actually are proven to book calls or like convert.
That's what we optimize on in the back end. So you're optimizing around qualified call? Yes.
So rather than optimizing around a DM, you're optimizing around a conversion event. Exactly. Of getting somebody actually booked.
Which I want to be very clear, got that from him. And so long story short, this. believe it or not, on some client accounts, we're getting like leads, like inbound DMs for like $4 at like, you know, a grand or two grand a day.
Yeah. Which like $4 a lead is, I would say, pretty damn good. A lot is, yeah.
Now, the thing is, there's this thing called a sales team. Sales teams aren't always the best. That's a constraint we're figuring out.
But like at that scale, even if let's say - It makes a lot of sense. You got three different ways you can pimp out a piece of content that's working well to do a lot better. Scroll up for me.
Yeah. Lever one, We've got collabs and shout outs where we're just taking an existing piece of content Adding a page as a collaborator or paying them to shout it out, which means they're gonna post on their own Yep, we're spending anywhere from four grand a 50k a month on this Purdue.
Yep. We go to level two We're taking the piece of content that worked and we're just trying to change either how it's formatted or Something about it like a font or a subtle to b -roll differences like there's just some so we're gonna repost the same Yep. Okay, and then the third layer We're introducing paid ads.
And we're taking the pieces of content that worked, putting them into a campaign. We're doing the three cold ad sets in this case, broad, interest, stack, lookalike audiences. Putting the same 10 pieces of content in each one.
We're turning them into a paid ad at that point instead of being an organic piece of content. But we're optimizing towards pushing them to a call booking page. that has a scheduled standard event or some kind of custom conversion that represents qualified book call.
So that's audience growth as a strategy. And the best part is, is like this happened from like one of the inner circle calls, right? Where it's like play into your sales team strength.
This we realized we're good with DMs. We know how to nurture them, convert them to slightly different setting process because you need to nurture them up a bit more, which we're probably through like. front end tornado or hammer them strategies, we could solve that problem.
But that just allows us to really like kind of stack onto the setters, right? And really kind of like feed them where now we can just expand the setting team and like makes scaling per se like quite a bit simpler. Yeah, it makes a lot of sense.
I mean, it's pretty much what you're doing on YouTube too though. Podcasts and speaking gigs is like the collapse, I would say. I was going to say, my version of audience growth is either A, get richer talk nowadays, B, a broader topic that just has a higher probability to get more views, C, occasionally going on somebody else's channel and getting more viewership from them and like literally doing a collaborator post like what you and i are doing on this exact video as an example i'll also occasionally do what you're saying i'll take my content i'll do paid distribution on it and i'll get more viewership there and i'll retarget those people with direct response based outcomes so pretty much the same game it sounds like i do try to stay away though to be fair from the paid shout outs on other randoms pages.
That's just not as applicable for me, but I understand the point as to why it would be very applicable. We wouldn't do it for like a very B2B audience. For a B2B audience though, we would do follower ads.
Follower ads seems to be popping back up. And like, even for us, it's something we're actively exploring because again, if you find a way to get a good optimization in, they can rip. Okay, so what to do if things aren't working?
And this one on my end, Like I've gone through pockets where I've either hit like stall points. And when I really look at the content during those specific period of times, I was either repetitive with what I would specifically communicate.
So I'd say evolve would be the key word there in comparison for me staying like stagnant. Agreed. I'd also say for me, something that worked really well was new formats.
So I introduced like the business breakdown format. I actually invest in right now into building out new environments to be able to introduce new formats. New formats for me is consistently done good.
I'd also say you have to actually talk to your customers. So if I'm in periods of times where I'm looking at my content or my revenue and it's just not going up into the right perpetually, getting more involved with the people that are already paying us is very important because usually the way that they want outcomes has changed, meaning like there's a mechanism update that needs to occur.
Or there's like a new set of circumstances or problems that they find themselves in that I need to adapt to and like stay in communication with. Simply put, the way that I found four things to perpetually work is, is to actually communicate about the things that my people are actually dealing with in real time. And if I simply make content in a way where it's like, I'm sitting down and just trying to churn out content to meet like a content quota of some kind.
I'll do terrible like that. If I sit down and, yeah, I might have a quantity that I'm after, that doesn't negate the fact that I have to actually talk about the things that my people are dealing with. To simplify everything I just said, don't reach.
or stop reaching. And by reaching, I mean like you're talking about some shit that like you don't really know about. You ran out of ideas officially.
And again, you're just trying to yap for the sake of getting a piece of content out. I'd rather take a break during that period of time and kind of like regroup and recalibrate in comparison to just continuing to dump a bunch of stuff. I feel like that's a big way personal brands die.
It's just bullshit coming out of their mouths. But I think it's like, I like, I come from a sports background. So my thing is like, when you look at like the all -time greats, like Hobie, MJ, like whenever somebody finds out Detroit, they just find you.
tricks yeah like because they study the game i'm like as a personal brand you gotta have like i think you gotta study the game you gotta be actually some form of like a consumer it's like you like probably kobe bryan was probably the one like that was consuming the most game tape That's true. So vice versa.
He's in the gym the longest. So for us, both me and my business partner, I think we actually watch more content than all of our writers because we got to know what the is happening in the market. What is shifting?
What are the nuances? And then the second thing, what you said, speaking to customers, I like listening to client sales calls just because you can see their mental narratives that they have. And then that in and of itself helps us with a few problems to go and figure out what are knowledge gaps.
and then again if we if we have like dude we get some like gnarly feedback where people tell us hey this is happening and then you just make very specific content around it which like that usually like there's a pretty good trick because obviously if it happens multiple times there's there's a genuine like disconnect there makes total sense Evolve new formats, talk to customers, study the game, more unique, go out there and consume more content, see what specifically may have changed in your niche or topic ideas that you may be completely whiffing on compared to what everybody else is actually consuming.
Essentially during those periods of times, it's also important to note, you're probably gonna feel more burnt out and you're probably gonna feel more like low morale. You're just gonna be in a period of time where you're probably thinking you're getting f***ed on and smoked. And those are tough periods of times.
to be able to pull yourself out of and to be able to randomly create like excessive growth and truly rebound. I would also tell you in that period of time, the idea of trying to get big wins should be minimized to just creating momentum again. I think that a lot of people will struggle to just manage the momentum that they're after.
And if momentum dies, the first thing you should focus on is not the big things and getting back to where you once were. The first thing you should focus on is just, let me regroup and let me try to just get some momentum in general. Let me try to get some quick wins.
Let me try to just get some general stuff that's coming my way. Let me get positive comments coming through again. Let me see some uptrends.
When I very first started in my career, a long time ago, I could talk about retargeting. Like just straight up, like nobody had pixels on their website. Nobody.
You could just say, you need a pixel on your site. Imagine how silly I'd sound saying that today. It wouldn't make any sense.
I'd sound super archaic and outdated. It's like, well, nowadays what I have to talk about in the context of retargeting is much more sophisticated content remarketing campaigns that fit at like a very specific step in the process that we originate. Right.
And then as time goes on, you'll see it time and time again. Like the people who die are just spamming the same shit. And there's no evolution there to like what they're talking about or the content.
I like to use Drake as an example, the rapper. Drake has done an incredible job. Like when I listened to him as a kid, I think I was in like middle school or maybe high school at the very latest.
When I very first became aware of Drake back when it was Lil Wayne putting Drake on. You remember that? And then as time had gone on.
Drake is still super relevant today while we sit here and film this exact video. And if you look at Drake, like way back in the day, it's completely different than the guy that stands before us today. And he's an example of what I mean by evolve, right?
It's like, you have to consider your people are growing with you. And I think as part of growing, you have to detach, right? So I think there's a lot of perks around that are attached like once down, that's just what they pop in, copy, paste.
Great term, great term. You can't actually go and do that. I like to go and reverse engineer.
Like we've recently realized that we're like these days, like look at the sales industry as an example. I like the sales trainer industry. Like in my opinion, I still wholeheartedly believe that as example, like one Jeremy Miner still, my opinion, like one of the best sales trainers out there.
But from a sales volume perspective, from like these newbie guys, like he'd probably lack what I would call or like I've seen on calls called lore. Where like these guys want to buy someone that has a bit more aura than something else. And so like now if you're doing content, let's say they were targeting the same people.
you got to go and let that influence, like sort of like how you frame your content in a sense. Because if you just do the same, like, hey, here, like doing a tactical video, that probably won't work as well anymore. And if you refuse to make those kind of like, again, it's the same, like the blockbuster kind of, if you fail to evolve and you fail to like say, hey, this is what's working.
Here's how I can fit into this. Yeah. Probably not going to work.
Last thing. We'll wrap it up with this. Longevity.
So a lot of what we just talked about, I gotta be frank and say, and I think optimizes around longevity quite well, but to be very direct, the idea that if you do just consistently spam the same forever, right? And like the Drake analogy, if you don't grow with your people that are listening to you, you risk the death of you.
And you risk getting to this point where like you will stagnate month over month over month. I get people occasionally join into my Jeremy's Inner Circle program and they'll be like, yo, I am in a position, where I've just spammed the same content for like months on end.
I'm not getting nearly the amount of revenue I was organically. And they'll tell me some like I want to introduce paid. And I'll be like, look, I have no issue with helping you with that.
But like, just to be very frank with you, you know, you're making some big mistakes here, like we just discussed that are going to prevent you from actually experiencing what you're trying to experience. I feel like a lot of the people who fail to optimize around longevity get caught on the idea that the audience that they're selling to today.
still exists tomorrow in the same state that it's in today. And I feel like as a result of that, they fail to move forward and help their people evolve, right? So it's like, as an example of my content on my channel, even this very video, literally that we're doing right now is an example of an evolution to a longer format of a video.
It's over the top helpful. In addition to that, I'm trying to literally from a mission perspective, save you money from having to go get by a lot of these people that I consider copycat personal brands.
I'm seeing people in real time that are just solely taking the things that I've talked about for free on my YouTube channel. And they're trying to charge for it. They're making programs about it.
And I'm like, that's like 10 to 20 % of what people even need to know. And they're not even paying the people who are actually originating these things. It's like an enemy or a villain in my story that I'm trying to counter with this evolved format of content that people sit here and consume.
Now, if you think about it from a perspective of longevity, like that's what helps create it, right? What's your take on longevity? I would say that, but also too, I think a lot of people forget where they come from.
So like, it's kind of like, you know, like the rapper types that are like super humble, super grounded. They're like, they're like one from the hood. And then when they make it out, they're like, you know, a bunch of flashy and they basically like, you know, start going to the club every day.
So it's kind of that realm. To me, the biggest thing is like, let's say in the context of personal brands, right? If you teach specific strategy.
if you then just think that i've outgrown this i am not talking about xyz anymore i think that's where most people like themselves yeah like i think there's two layers one they just build like a one -legged stool yeah right but it's just like one thing and then they stop doing it because they lack the discipline or they have only one layer and if they make a switch the audience is give a about it so like take someone like iman gazi as an example right he's actually built the right foundations where like What he sells is one layer, but there's also like, you know, his story and whatever on it.
He could realistically pivot to almost anything. Yes. Because he's got the foundation.
He's pivoted crypto, SMMA, personal branding. At one point, it's all freaking like sparkling water. I didn't even know that.
So there's a lot that he has layers, but it's like because it's built on the right foundation. Yeah, that makes sense. I think most people don't build a foundation.
And second of all, I think they fall into the trap of like selling out, churning and burning through an audience, then making a 180 pivot, and then trying to run the same audience. That's so true. That makes so much sense.
I have one last one for you. Pepper, it might not be the best. Retargeting ads.
And I see this on a data layer perspective, right? We have dozens of deals. And now we have some paid ad agencies.
If you're watching this, please get... that we actively hate because all that they do is they log it to the ad account and they go retargeting spend a thousand dollars a day boom and then they're like it's our best campaign surprise surprise yeah however the very interesting thing is we have one deal that we have joined together right you know who i'm speaking about that particular brand since the android media update is the only brand deal where if We have massive volume of inbound leads.
We don't, inside of the account, see that as a follower, you get spammed with paid ads. The only account. Every other account - We optimize around cold.
Because on every other account, they optimize around, let's go to the warmest first, which I kind of get, but the problem is - Which is not scalable. The reason organic works, because they sell themselves. They come to the conclusion that this person can help me.
I made the decision. And people are egotistical, so they want to have that. If you now throw them with all these ads and offers that you're making them, over time, some people will churn and burn.
And on top of that, you make wrong, in my opinion, you index wrong insights from your paid ad campaigns. So now your audience eventually might burn out because they get so many ads, they're like, I'm not really interested. And because then they don't see your content, you can't remind them and loop them back in.
Makes sense. There's this crazy statistic that if somebody watches your content and follows you, unless they get hit with another piece within like i think 30 days they forgot who you are and what you do oh i would say forget you if they only saw you in 30 days from now but it's incredible right We're like, you actually need, like, we want to optimize around someone having goodwill built and also having it built where like, even if they might get retargeted, but it's not like you get chat around because otherwise if you burn people out and they're like, oh, he's just trying to sell something.
You need to almost do like backwards PR work to have any form of goodwill. Well, hey, thank you guys so much for watching. Make sure you guys check out Jeremy Moser and all his channels.
This is an example of the caliber of awesome talent that we all have amongst us in my Jeremy's Inner Circle group. Shout out to a fellow, Jeremy, holding it down as a professional and doing great out. out there in the field.
Make sure you check out those links down in the description for offers like Jeremy's Inner Circle or my Jeremy AI clone. And more importantly than anything else, make sure you go get Richard. Talk soon.
The Hook
The bait, then the rug-pull.
The cold open stacks three claims in fifteen seconds: one big post beats fifty small ones, a proven reel can be multiplied three or four times over, and the whole system started at two hours a week. Then two operators, one a YouTube-first B2B seller and one an Instagram agency, spend the next hour and forty-five minutes arguing out how organic content actually turns into money.
Frameworks
Named ideas worth stealing.
02:48model
Awareness / Nurture / Conversion organic funnel
Awareness: reach strangers
Nurture: educate followers on you, the model and why to buy
Conversion: turn bought-in followers into buyers
Treat organic content like a paid funnel. Weight the mix toward whichever stage is missing: no audience means awareness, views without sales means conversion, leads without closes means objection-handling nurture.
Steal forplanning a weekly content calendar by funnel stage
24:23model
The 3x3
Awareness: B-roll plus text reels ('silent storytelling') on broad story topics
Nurture: talking-head or green-screen reels on tactical topics
Conversion: tweet-style carousels with case studies and deep breakdowns plus a direct CTA
Three formats crossed with three funnel stages, chosen from what the niche already engages with and what you can say uniquely. Rotate formats over time so the audience can't predict you.
Steal fordeciding what to post on Instagram each week
25:14concept
Brand-market fit
The overlap between formats and topics the niche already watches (found by sorting competitors' posts by performance) and the things you have a unique take on. Bet on a proven horse instead of moonshotting.
Steal forpicking topics before launching a new account
44:57model
Niche / Adjacent / Random inspiration (the dart system)
Niche: direct competitors and creators
Adjacent: one layer out (Airbnb to broader real estate)
Random: unrelated creative niches such as travel and vegan creators
Mirror how the algorithm hunts for a bullseye by exposing yourself to three rings of content, then transform the hooks you find into your niche.
Steal forbuilding a swipe file that doesn't look like your competitors
52:14list
Short-form outline
Hook
Context to hold attention
Build up to and deliver the main point
Call to action
Outline in bullets rather than a verbatim script, frame the idea for its funnel job, then compare the outline against proven swipes for re-hooks and flow.
Steal forprepping a reel in under an hour
1:02:02model
Two lead paths: comment vs DM
Comment a keyword: colder viewers, sent a lead magnet in DMs, lower open rate
DM a keyword: warmer viewers, kept in a direct-response conversation, higher response rate
Mixing both CTAs balances lead quantity and quality while keeping people on the platform, which Instagram rewards.
Steal forchoosing the CTA for each post
1:10:23list
Profile optimization stack
Bio line three: CTA to a valuable resource
Highlights: My Story, Behind the Scenes, Case Studies / Wins, Q&A
Three pinned posts that handle objections, explain the model and show a client result
Most people decide from the profile, so every layer answers a question a curious visitor has at that moment and carries a CTA.
Steal forauditing an Instagram profile
1:12:30list
The three sells of DM setting
The guy: this creator can help me
The vehicle: this business model works
Their ability: I can do it
Setters guide a 12 to 15 message conversation until the lead affirms all three. Missing one shows up later as no-shows.
Steal forwriting a setter script or sales call opener
1:14:15model
DM funnel math
10,000 inbound conversations
60% respond to the first message: 6,000
10% of responders book a call: 600
Response rates have fallen from 80 to 90% as comment automation spread. Skeptical leads can be routed straight to a webinar if one runs within 24 to 48 hours.
Steal forforecasting setter capacity and calls from a content plan
1:20:52model
Per-post revenue tracking
Contextual keyword CTA unique to each post
ManyChat tags the keyword on each contact
Setter sends a booking link with the chat ID appended as a dynamic UTM
Hidden form field stores the chat ID
Call and payment data link back to the post
Lets you see revenue, calls, setter and time-to-book per post, plus which posts drive new followers via Instagram's insights filter.
Steal forattributing organic revenue without a pixel
1:28:19list
Three levers to scale a winning post
Lever 1: paid collabs and shout-outs on niche theme pages ($4K to $50K a month, scale under $10 per lead)
Lever 2: trial reels in three or four format variations
Lever 3: DM ads with 10 proven posts across 1% lookalike, interest stack and broad ad sets, optimized for a qualified booked call
Once data shows which posts make money, amplify them instead of hunting for the next viral hit.
Steal forplanning a paid boost budget around organic winners
1:35:59list
When content stalls
Evolve the message
Introduce new formats
Talk to current customers
Study the game
Be more unique; stop reaching
Stalls usually come from repetition and running out of real things to say. Rebuild momentum with small wins before chasing old highs.
Steal fordiagnosing a content slump
CTA Breakdown
How they asked for the click.
VERBAL ASK
1:08:30product
“This would be way easier if you just use Jeremy AI. There's a link for it down in the description... If you're rich trying to get a hell of a lot richer, link down in the description.”
Delivered as a live demonstration of the YouTube lead-gen method being taught, mid-video inside the lead gen chapter, then repeated at the close. Openly framed as the reason the content exists.
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A marketing millionaire stands in front of a Miami mastermind room and dares everyone in it to admit they're lying to themselves about how hard they're trying and how much money they actually need.
Jeremy Haynes breaks down what actually controls Meta ad targeting, why your pixel isn't as smart as you think it is, and the exact 'Thunderdome' testing system he uses to find the 1-3% of ads that truly scale.
A creator who says he nets seven figures a month explains why he built his content engine around revenue instead of views, and why one channel still does 90% of the work.
A live 68-minute business audit of a trading algorithm offer — tracing how an 8x ROAS collapsed to 3x, how a lazy setter team was the real cause, and why the $250K/month webinar unlock keeps getting avoided.
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