The argument in one line.
Dane Cook's massive early success and internet-driven rise to arena comedy created a cultural backlash that positioned him as comedy's villain, but the criticism was fundamentally a reflection of industry gatekeeping rather than legitimate artistic failure.
Read if. Skip if.
READ IF YOU ARE…
- A working comedian with 5-10 years of stage time who's plateaued and wants to understand how to rebuild momentum after a reputation setback.
- Someone building an audience through social platforms before algorithms existed and curious how that early-internet strategy actually worked in practice.
- A performer in any medium who's experienced public backlash or become a cultural punching bag and needs perspective on surviving that arc.
- You're interested in the actual craft and mentality of stand-up as a 30-year discipline, not just comedy as entertainment or business.
SKIP IF…
- You're looking for tactical advice on modern comedy algorithms, TikTok strategy, or current streaming platform growth — this focuses on pre-algorithm Myspace era tactics.
- You want a step-by-step guide to stand-up basics like joke structure, timing, or how to write your first five minutes — this assumes you already do comedy.
The full version, fast.
Stand-up is a craft built in public over decades, and the people who last are the ones who treat their audience as collaborators rather than spectators. Dane Cook's career illustrates the mechanism: relentless reps in hostile rooms forge taste, direct fan relationships (Myspace, now TikTok) compound an army nobody else can poach, and a long-form game plan converts viral spikes into sustainable demand instead of one-hit flameouts. The actionable conclusions for any creator are concrete: never chase virality without a persona and roadmap ready to absorb it, learn stillness before flourish, structure every story in three acts with room for live improvisation, ignore the backlash that always follows a peak, and protect your integrity by reading every contract yourself.
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00:00hostChris Van Vliet
00:07guestDane Cook
Where the time goes.
00:00 – 07:00
01 · Ernest Glenn origin story
The accidental first set under a fake name; Cook discovers he is a pressure player, not an anxious kid.
07:00 – 15:00
02 · Boston comedy boot camp
The class of Burr, Patrice O'Neal, Gary Gulman; why performing for hostile Boston crowds was the best comedy education money couldn't buy.
15:00 – 24:00
03 · Myspace and the 14-year overnight success
How Cook used early internet (Myspace, fan CDs, meet-and-greets) to build an army before the algorithm era; the Penn State 12,500-person moment.
24:00 – 33:00
04 · The arena run and the backlash
Skipping theaters straight to arenas; why jealousy from the comedy world and industry narrative mechanics turned him into the 'Nickelback of comedy.'
33:00 – 42:00
05 · Above It All — the special
Why he self-funded, shot on IMAX, hired director Marty Culner, and why the stalker story in the special required 11 years of craft to tell right.
42:00 – 51:00
06 · Dave Chappelle myth-busting + movies
Cook debunks the 6M-view 'Chappelle savagely ruins Cook's career' story; discusses movies and which roles he's proud of.
51:00 – 1:00:12
07 · Mentorship, craft, and gratitude
Advice to young comics (protect your integrity, read your contracts), how love changes your life, gratitude to parents, and not knowing what comes after this special.
Lines worth screenshotting.
- Dane Cook's first stand-up set happened by accident — he lied about being Ernest Glenn to fill an open mic spot for someone who did not show up.
- The pressure of performing before he was ready identified something about himself: he is a pressure player who performs better when there is no safety net.
- Getting a few laughs from a room of 40 people his first night was enough to produce a clear signal — he got on stage again six days later.
- Severe social anxiety and introversion in school did not prevent a stand-up career; the stage created a split identity where a different, more capable self emerged.
- Using Myspace years before algorithms existed to build a cult audience demonstrates that distribution strategy creates career outcomes independent of gatekeepers.
- Selling out arenas while simultaneously becoming the internet's favorite punching bag illustrates that peak popularity and peak resentment can coexist.
- Self-funding a comedy special is the comedian's version of owning your stack — no label, no studio, no executive approval required.
- Thirty-one years of consistent stage time produces craft that is invisible to audiences who only see the polish, not the accumulated reps.
- The inability to stop doing stand-up despite hecklers, failed nights, and bad pay is not masochism — it is the signal that this is the correct vocation.
- Stand-up comedy at its best is a constant loop of asking why did that work, why did that fail — it is a structured feedback system run nightly.
- The Nickelback comparison illustrates a pattern where mass popularity during peak cultural saturation generates outsized backlash that is disproportionate to any actual offense.
- An Ernest Glenn — the person who did not show up and gave someone else their shot — exists in most origin stories and rarely gets the credit.
What 31 years looks like from the inside.
Creator playbook
Cook didn't go viral — he compounded 14 years of in-person relationship-building until the internet made it visible.
- Build your own machine first. A platform without your own character beneath it will use you and discard you.
- The Nickelback moment is a predictable arc — plan for it instead of being surprised by it. Cook saw it coming and found it liberating.
- Plant your feet. If your current mode of performance has a weakness, take a year to do nothing but fix that one thing.
- Self-funding gives you radical creative control — Cook shot Above It All on IMAX at his own house, hired his own director, and didn't ask permission.
- Your origin story is your best content. Cook has told the Ernest Glenn story for 31 years and it still lands because it's true and it's his.
- The contract is where you lose. Cook's mentorship to young comics is almost entirely legal: read the 40-page contract, walk away from the 40-page contract.
Terms worth knowing.
- Open mic
- An unpaid live event where anyone who signs up gets a short slot on stage, used by comedians to test new material in front of a real audience.
- Junket interview
- A short promotional interview, usually three to five minutes, that talent does back-to-back with many outlets in one day to promote a film or project.
- Bomb
- Comedian slang for a set that gets few or no laughs, leaving the performer to finish in front of a silent or hostile crowd.
- Heckler
- An audience member who interrupts a live performance with unsolicited comments, forcing the comedian to either ignore them or fire back in real time.
- Hell gig
- Comedian slang for a disastrous booking — wrong room, hostile crowd, broken sound, or all three — that becomes a war story afterward.
- Sketch and improv
- Two live comedy formats: sketch is short pre-written scenes performed by a troupe, and improv is unscripted scenes built from audience suggestions or games.
- The boom of the eighties
- The 1980s explosion of stand-up comedy in the US, when comedy clubs multiplied, network specials proliferated, and a Tonight Show set could launch a career.
- Myspace
- An early-2000s social network where users curated a personal profile page and ranked their closest connections in a public 'Top 8,' heavily used by musicians and comedians to build direct fanbases before Facebook took over.
- Comedy Central
- A US cable channel that became the dominant TV home for stand-up specials and showcase formats in the late 1990s and 2000s, turning club comics into household names.
- Meet and greet
- A scheduled post-show session where performers stay to take photos, sign merch, and talk briefly with fans, often used to build a personal connection beyond the show itself.
- TikTok
- A short-form video app where an algorithmic feed pushes clips to viewers based on engagement signals rather than who they follow, making it possible for unknown creators to reach huge audiences fast.
- Clubhouse
- A drop-in audio chat app that briefly went viral during the pandemic, letting users join live voice-only rooms hosted by other users.
- Vicious Circle
- Dane Cook's 2006 HBO stand-up special filmed in the round at Madison Square Garden, often cited as a template for the cinematic arena-comedy special.
- Isolated Incident
- Dane Cook's 2009 stand-up special, his follow-up to Vicious Circle, that leaned into more personal and introspective material.
- IMAX
- A premium large-format film and projection system using oversized cameras and screens to capture sharper, more immersive footage than standard cinema cameras.
- TCL Chinese Theatre
- The historic Hollywood movie palace on Hollywood Boulevard, formerly known as Grauman's Chinese and then Mann's Chinese, famous for celebrity premieres and the handprints in its forecourt.
- Pile-on
- Internet slang for a wave of public criticism that snowballs as users echo and amplify each other's attacks on the same target.
- Laugh Factory
- A landmark Los Angeles comedy club on the Sunset Strip used by working comedians to test material and run sets in front of industry crowds.
- Comedy Cellar
- A long-running New York comedy club in Greenwich Village known as a proving ground where established comics drop in unannounced to work out new material.
- Tag
- In stand-up, an additional punch line stacked onto a joke after the main laugh, squeezing one or two more laughs out of the same setup.
Things they pointed at.
03:52channelBill Burr
03:56channelPatrice O'Neal
40:02productMarty Culner (director, Vicious Circle)
41:40productTCL Chinese Theatre IMAX premiere
Lines you could clip.
03:03
“I needed the wind machine, and I had the mullet, so that probably would have worked.”
26:06
“I was on the cover of Time Magazine in the same year that people were saying I sucked — as one of the most influential people on the planet.”
25:58
“There's me, and then there's a version of me that lives on the Internet.”
26:02
“If you don't have a machine of your own, that machine will use you.”
36:54
“This woman said I'm going to kill you, and I remember sitting there thinking, man, I wish I read this after I ate this pizza.”
51:58
“If somebody hands you a 40-page contract, you're in rough shape.”
Where the conversation goes.
00:00 – 09:20denseOrigin story and early open mics
09:20 – 15:00denseBoston comedy scene, Bill Burr, Patrice O'Neal
15:00 – 26:00denseMyspace, internet audience-building, arena run
26:00 – 34:00denseBacklash, Nickelback of comedy, press narrative
34:00 – 43:20denseAbove It All — self-funding, IMAX, Marty Culner, stalker story
43:20 – 51:00steadyDave Chappelle story debunked, movies
51:00 – 1:00:12steadyMentorship, craft evolution, fiance, gratitude
Word for word.
metaphoranalogy
00:07Thank you for making the time to do this. Dude, thank you for making the time. No.
00:10Thank you. No. You did it.
00:12I'm here because of this guy. It's been the last interview we did was nine years ago. Is that right?
00:17For what? What did we do? Planes.
00:19That's right. Was it fire and rescue, or is it the first time? First one.
00:22Santa Monica Airport. Do you remember that junket? Yeah.
00:25I think it was there was there was planes
00:27in the in the area. Yeah. Yeah.
00:29Yeah. I remember I wore, like, a tan or a banana colored suit. Yes.
00:34Right? Did you recently watch this clip or something? No.
00:37I just I have a weird thing about, like, what I was wearing at at certain points. You told me this great story. And it's always so difficult when you do junket interviews because they're so quick.
00:45Right? Right. Three, four minutes.
00:46You told me this great story about Ernest Glenn. Wow. Ernest Glenn.
00:51Yeah. That's the first
00:53person that didn't show up for a comedy gig, an open mic as we call them. And I I filled in without even knowing I was gonna go on stage for the very first time.
01:04That was the guy's name that didn't show up. Right. When the host said, where's Ernest Glenn?
01:08I said, that's me. And then I ended up doing my first comedy show ever Wow. As Ernest Glenn.
01:13There was some weird background are you, Ernest Glenn? I never found that guy, man. Really?
01:18What do you think Ernest Glenn was a real name? Oh, yeah. I definitely feel like they were going to the list of people that signed up for the potluck or whatever.
01:24And when he didn't show or maybe he I don't know. Maybe he left or whatever it was, but I was from time to time, I'll just Facebook and be like, where is Ernest Glenn? I wanna reach out and say thank you for starting
01:35my career by not showing up. There was this weird backwards tie in to the movie, to Plains, because Dusty got his way into the tournament
01:46by faking a name. And I didn't even know this Ernest Glenn thing. I didn't know any of this stuff.
01:51I don't remember any of that. Really? Yeah.
01:53Okay. Because I was like, was there It mirrored my comedy career. By accident.
01:57And then Dusty Croppapper, Dane Cook, the DC. Oh, yeah.
02:02Yeah. There was a lot of, like, little hidden Easter eggs that I felt like were in there kind of speaking to my comedy career. But Ernest Glenn.
02:10Wow. I Wow. Thirty one years later doing stand up comedy.
02:14And when I hear that name, it probably impacts me more than any other name that you could say because it made my life what it is Wow. Completely because one person decided not to show up for a show.
02:26Were you terrified when you got on stage the first time? I what I didn't even have time. I was honestly, it all happened so fast.
02:32I think if I knew what was going on that night, I'd be sitting there like, you know, oh my goodness. Wait. Am I gonna bomb?
02:37It happened so fast that then I was up there, and then I'm just doing some jokes or routines that I thought someday when I sign up, I'll do the Then I'm just going into it. But the one thing I remember about that first set first of all, I did get a few laughs in a in a room full of 30 or 40 people.
02:54I got a few laughs, but what I remember is feeling like right away knowing I'm a pressure player.
03:04When it was really, like, put on me, like, you have to make this work right now Yeah. I identified almost immediately. Maybe all the jokes weren't great.
03:12Maybe I was lackluster in this area or that, but I was prepared to, like, meet that moment. And so moving forward, was like, okay.
03:20I'll be okay once I get up there even though maybe offstage I was a little ragtag. And then were you like, I gotta do this immediately again? Oh, yeah.
03:27Yeah. Yeah. If I didn't do it immediately, it was almost like, my god.
03:29Is this gonna like that fear of can I be funnier? Do I have you know, can I expand upon that?
03:38Especially when you're a young comic, you're kind of in your head ruminating about all that stuff. So I think I got on stage about six days later at a place called the ninety nines, which was a bar that had another, like, open mic situation where you could sign up and get in front of, like, all the people were just watching whatever the local sports was, and you get up on stage and try to pull their attention towards you.
04:00And I think I got a few people to take their eyes off the game. But, no, after Ernest the Ernest Glenn moment, it was I I knew this was my life.
04:09I just find it so difficult watching your comedy and speaking with you that you You find it difficult watching my comedy. I love that's a segue that I can get into.
04:18I find it very difficult watching your comedy. I just I can't digest it. No.
04:23Where are you going It's with
04:26hard to believe
04:27that you were an anxious person growing up. Oh, my goodness. Yeah.
04:31I was an introvert. I was like one of those people that you know, in school the thought of having to forget about getting in front of the class, the thought of even if the teacher asks me something, I was mortified at the thought of it.
04:48When it did happen, I was even more like just discombobulated at that moment, but I would be sitting there tapping my toe going, please don't call me. Like, or in sports, please don't pass the ball to me.
04:58I'd never wanted any participation because I was so scared that I would not come through.
05:04How does that turn into being
05:06a prolific stand up comedian? You know how many people over the years that I went to school with were like, where did that like, how? You know?
05:13Because they knew that about me, that I was just really trepidatious and had a lot of social anxiety, right? But that first set, and I told my mom later that night, because I told her what happened, she said, well, how did you do?
05:27And I said, I think I I exceeded my expectations. I mean, some of the jokes, even if they missed, it wasn't cringey, and I kind of commented on it.
05:40I almost had, like, a little commentary to say, like, you know what? That joke's not ready for public consumption. Let's move on.
05:46Let's pretend that Yeah. And I was covering and improving, so it was almost like a Clark Kent Superman kind of moment, except I wasn't pretending to be Clark Kent.
05:58I was really Clark Kent. But on the stage, man, it it became it felt like a little bit of a superpower. Like, Sasha or Sasha what is Sasha Fierce, Beyonce.
06:08Right? A little bit. I just needed the wind machine, and and I had the mullet, so that probably would have worked.
06:13But it it it was I identified immediately that I I had a place in the world. If I wanted to just cultivate it Yeah.
06:21Maybe it would, you know, pay the rent. So it was very performative? It it was yeah.
06:27I mean, in the first year, it was everything that stand up comedy should and shouldn't be.
06:34Every bit of it that was, like, could be exceptional and forward moving and feeling evolution, and then all the stuff that you hear about hell gigs and nightmare situations and heckler battles and not getting paid and failing miserably.
06:51But you can't stop doing it because you're in a constant state of like, why did that work? Why didn't I work there? Why did that crowd not like me?
06:59What and you start figuring, like, I need to try pushing buttons tonight. I have to I remember when I went to New York City being, like, I'm gonna see how far I can let the ship leave the shore. How much can I turn them off on purpose to see when can I, you know, bring them back to me?
07:15So you need years and years and years of that try and fail. Yeah. And you need them equally.
07:20You need very, very bad moments coupled with highlight moments.
07:25When do you feel like you turned the corner and you were like, I am now a comedian? When
07:31did I yeah. Because I was really embarrassed to say it for a long time. I actually was.
07:35It's a good question because I didn't I couldn't say to you, I I do stand up comedy. I think I was a little ashamed of it.
07:42I I I just didn't I was I was very beta. What was the job up till then?
07:49Pizza. I worked at a pizza place. So slinging pies.
07:52I was a dietary aid at a nursing home. I worked at a video store, you know, renting movies.
07:59I I sold the Boston Globe out of a truck at a at a Walgreens. I mean, I did anything I could to continue the stand up comedy career and to avoid any legitimate nine to five. Because I knew if I went into a plan B, that like most people, you get kinda stuck.
08:15Yeah. Sort of in that. So I did a lot of miscellaneous part time stuff, and then doing gigs where, you know, if you could make 20 or 30 or $40 and just, you know, put it in the till and go, okay, I got two more weeks of this I could probably do, and then I gotta figure out how to pick up some hours at like the pizza place.
08:32So but eventually, were like, okay. I'm gonna lean into this. Yeah.
08:37I think that it was like the first two years, it was like this hobby that I had a a real affinity for and made me feel it made me feel like like I had purpose.
08:52It really did. It made me feel like anything was better than how I felt kind of when I woke up and thought about facing the world.
09:02Was almost like, this place, I have the ability to I don't want to make it like model in and say, I felt special. I really felt like, all right, this is a little thing I can contribute.
09:12This works sometimes. And then after about three or four years, I was in a comedy group, we were doing sketch and improv, and improv games, and I played guitar.
09:22We did anything we could on stage, make up songs, and just anything and everything to entertain people. And after about three or four years doing that, I quit all my jobs, and then I was a full time comedian, and that's when I had to finally start letting people know, yeah, this is what I do.
09:39I'm a comic. Oh, really? Be funny.
09:41And then it was just mortifying to
09:43It's so funny. Like, comedians and magicians fall into that same category where it's like you tell them that you do that for a living and they're like, prove it to me now. Go.
09:51Exactly. Exactly. It's somebody once said it's like, you know, it's not like you meet a plumber and go, lay down some PVC piping.
09:57Let's see.
09:59Grab some copper tubing and and make a, you know, make a kitchen sink work. But Every magician I've ever known does have a deck of cards with them. Is that true?
10:07Yes. To redo some sleight of hand. Because they're like, alright.
10:10Here you go. I'll show you something. I think I probably, some time into my career, always had, uh, you know, a CD or something.
10:17So if somebody was like, are you funny? I'd be like, here. Just take it.
10:19If you write me an email, I'll know that you like my stuff. Be nothing worse than people being like, well, be funny if you're a comedian. Oh, man.
10:26And and a lot worse. Sometimes people think because you're a comedian they can just have at you because it's also in some way it's it's strange. In Boston, in that era, stand up comedy was two things at once.
10:41It was the boom of the eighties was happening. The Robin Williams and the, you know, the success of Mork and Mindy. And if you were on the Tonight Show, it was almost like Boston identified, man, if you're if you're good at this job, like, this is something really exceptional.
10:57Yeah. But they also because it was Boston and it was, like, it it was rough and tumbly in the area where I used to do stand up, if you didn't come with something that was exceptional in their eyes or met that expectation of the boom of the eighties, then, oh, man, they would just they they would they could really bring the hammer down on you.
11:22Looking back, best thing ever. Because it put you through boot camp in comedy. If you're good, they were like, you're good.
11:28And if you were half, they would just You'd be like, what the fuck are you doing? Like, just brutal, brutal, brutal after you got off stage.
11:35And so it kind of formed you to go In my comedy graduating class, it was like me, Bill Burr Wow. Patrice O'Neill, who sadly has passed away, Gary Gullman, and then a bevy of other comics that, like, if I threw some other names at you.
11:50But that class, we came up like, if we don't stick together and really hone our craft, this city will be like, you're not you're not representing this place very well.
12:02Joe Rogan in Boston at that time? He was a graduating class ahead.
12:07Him and CK were, like, the two or three years right before us. So when we were coming in, you had the legendary locals that to this day are still, like, some of the best comics I've ever seen in my life.
12:19Then you had guys like Maren, CK, Joe, and a lot of others that were in that a couple years before us.
12:29So they were quickly, like, getting out of there. Right. But, yeah, I did I remember there was a place in Boston.
12:35It was called Dick Dougherty's Shipwreck. It was a boat in the harbor, and I used to do shows there with Rogan all the time.
12:42We were always performing on this docked boat to people. There were some strange gigs back then, but, no, seeing those guys and how they then took their careers in some new directions from the former stars of comedy was it was good for us to be able to see that, like, oh, this is a career, man.
13:00Did you ever have the authentic Boston accent? My dad well, when I listen back on Harmful of Swallowed or the first stuff, I can hear it. But my dad did broadcasting, and he was big into enunciating.
13:14And so there were times in my life when I'd slip into it, and, like, when it gets late, I get tired. I'm like, dude, I'm I'm tired, kid.
13:22But my dad was always about, like, really articulating to tell a story because he did color commentary and sports stuff. So I had it, but I also didn't have it heavily because he kinda kept me, like, focused on you know, don't sound so regional. You know?
13:37Appeal to a broader audience, and don't just go like, oh, yeah. Everybody over at the harbor is down at he's like, make sure that you, you know, build up that that
13:46modulation and and use your voice to be able to speak to several people and not just a region. That was my exact move when I moved from Canada to The US. Is that right?
13:55I was like, I don't wanna sound I don't want someone to see me on TV and go, oh, that guy's clearly from Canada. Right. A little having a little bit of that inflection,
14:04it's great. It makes you identifiable. But I guess if it's too heavily a region, then it feels like you should only be in that.
14:11Right. Particular You don't hear a lot of here
14:15in The States, and they'd like, ah, you're not one of us. Yeah. What are you doing here?
14:18People often will hear the the Canadian accent from me because my dad's side came down for PEI.
14:24No. Oh, wow. We're all we're all Prince Edward Island, O'Hagans that came down and then couldn't get hired in Boston as O'Hagans.
14:33So they switched it to Cook to try to You could have, like, a bit of, like, a Wisconsin
14:38accent, perhaps. I don't know. It feels like a I don't know.
14:42Sometimes I I'm always asked about, like, now where are you from? People that don't know I'm from Boston, and it's kinda interesting sometimes where people think that I'm from.
14:52You know? Yeah. Maybe it's just changing a little bit of the accent in Boston or tempering it started to make people go like, I hear something in there, but I don't know exactly Yeah.
15:02You what it talk about the boom of comedy in the '80s, but you really brought comedy back in the February.
15:10Like, you made it, like, cool again.
15:13Well, it was like I was coming up with a generation of the next generation of comedy fans. And I could see that, like, oh, this is like an Internet generation. This isn't this isn't stand up at, like, just an underground spot with a brick wall.
15:28This is the the not only the Internet, but really, like, Comedy Central at its peak in in knowing, like, is stand up comedy is finding its way to be directly, not just a comic in a comedic role on a sitcom, just stand up public consumption of stand up comedy sets, right, from Comedy Central.
15:49So I looked at it like I was meeting college kids coming out of Boston, and when I would talk to them at, like, a meet and greet after, they would often say, this is my first comedy show. And the more I heard that, I was like, I'm the first comic they're seeing.
16:01So and I'd say, you've never seen so and so live, or they were already stars or they were already, you know, further along. So I was like, okay.
16:10I'm just gonna come up with this generation of comedy fans and see if I can,
16:14you know, be like their leader. And, I mean, in in it I I don't know if it was, like, something you were planning on doing. I don't know if it was
16:22a it just it worked. It worked. Well, it wasn't like I was at first, wasn't planning on, like, okay.
16:28Can I, like, lead the charge more than I was, like, I'm just gonna my dad once said, you you should do a lot of colleges because the things that you discover in your college years, you'll take with you for the rest of your life? That's good advice.
16:41Spoke to me, and he's like, and that means there'll always be somebody who probably wants to you remind them of that era, and they'll always wanna support you. So I was like, okay, at least you have the chance to have somewhat of a career to be able to do this long term, even though it might not be the full time gig since I love it.
16:59Yeah. But once I saw those numbers really expanding, and it wasn't just New England anymore, and it was people saying, hey, will you will you come to Vancouver?
17:08Will you come to Tempe, Arizona, and places that I never even, you know, at that time heard of, I was like, this is a this is happening. I I I was like, I got it.
17:17I I know what is this is this is getting bigger than me, but I'm but I'm fulfilling it because I'm putting out more content, and I'm doing meet and greets anywhere I go, and I'm really, like, ingratiating myself with a fan a new, you know, comedy fan that could be a fan for life.
17:35Was it still being met with the criticism from people that were like, it's just the Internet. Like, who needs that? Well, at first, yeah, there was a small period of time where people would say and it was so funny.
17:45I used to really think this was like they'd say, oh, he clicked a couple of buttons and filled up Madison Square Garden. Like, people really thought, oh, he he did the the Myspace thing, and he just clicked a button, and it was like, you know, listen.
17:59It it doesn't matter how much you bang the drum and get all the people in the circle to watch you. If you don't deliver on something, they will leave faster than they formed.
18:11Sure. So to me, it was like the clicking of the button was well, you didn't see the fourteen years prior to this that I was, you know, at the at the gig meeting meeting everybody longer than the show.
18:25Literally hanging out three hours after an hour and a half show to make sure everybody got a chance to get to know me and really build that army of fans. That's always such an interesting thing when it's the fourteen year overnight success. Right?
18:39I know. It's like and and people will say, did it how did it feel when it all just kinda happened?
18:44I'm like, it really never felt like that. It it it was on honestly, like, I'm at a college. There's 200 people.
18:51Wow. 200 people care about seeing me. Syracuse the next year.
18:55Hey. There's 420 people. And then, oh, wow.
18:57Now it's a thou you know, it's like, saw that year because I was playing those same schools. That was, like, part of my route year after year. So when I finally went to Penn State, I remember Penn State thought it was gonna be 5,500 people.
19:10And I had a couple things that were in the zeitgeist and a Comedy Central thing, and my first album was kinda still underground and people passing around, burning it or whatever. And then I remember Penn State called and said, hey, can we move this show to the field house?
19:25Because more than 5,500 people are clamoring to get in. And I was like, how many people?
19:30And they were like, it's about 8,500. And when we got to Penn State, it was 12,500 people had showed up.
19:40And that night, I was like, I'm taking this anywhere.
19:44I'm gonna take this to the biggest audiences that I am willing to take it to. Was that the biggest crowd you'd played at that time?
19:51At that time. 5,000, 6,000 before. Yeah.
19:55And then it just boom. It just was like, what's the local arena?
20:00Forget the college. What's the fifteen, twenty thousand seat arena? And then it was that for about three or four.
20:04I didn't even do theaters. I skipped theaters. Yeah.
20:07Because for so long, it was Which I missed. The comedian in front of the brick wall. Right.
20:12Or in the cafeteria doing the college gig or maybe a theater at the Yeah. Yeah. But it went from years and years of great clubs, you know, the comedy sellers and, of course, the laugh factories and, you know, Knicks Comedy Stop in Boston.
20:27It was, like, club, club, club, and then all these college audiences. And I was looking at theaters. I'm like, okay.
20:33I wanna play the Beacon. I wanna play the Fox Theater. I had all these ideas.
20:36You had the celebrity theater in Arizona, and then it just jumped. It went to only arenas for, I didn't even know, like a four or five year run before I came back.
20:46Was like, I'd I'd like to do these theaters. What do you think it was? Because so many comedians wish to play one arena show in their entire career.
20:54I think it was because of my energy, my the access to me that I think before that was well, it was not in vogue to know your audience.
21:06It was actually kind of a no no. I got a lot of shit early on because I treated it like a business.
21:12I treated it like everybody does today, podcasting and you know, you have to be entrepreneurial. It used to be a business of twenty three hours of the day nobody knows you. You're skulking around, you're a dark figure, you're somewhere in a corner.
21:24Then you come to life, you're only the funny person. And I was like, what? No, gonna I don't subscribe to that.
21:30I already knew I liked watching comedians on maybe on a Richard Pryor would do a talk show where he'd be very candid. Or a comic that I loved, like Robin Williams would do a role that had a lot of heart. And I was like, why can't people get to know that side of me and know, oh, he's funny when he's on stage.
21:48I think it was just a confluence of all those things of the energy, of course, routine that I worked on for so many years.
21:58They were really rooting for me because they knew me. They knew me as a pal online. And people, I'm telling you, man, they were writing, I knew we'd make it.
22:07We. I knew we would get you there. I knew we'd SNL.
22:12I knew that we would do that. It was always I used it. I always said we.
22:15I never said I wanna do that. I always talked to my audience and we're gonna do this together. Why don't we try to?
22:21I still, to this day, is that's how I feel. That's how I wanna communicate it. I'm I'm not there unless it's a we situation.
22:28Right? Yeah. But I have to give everything I have and do something that I think has been in the whole you know, in the never been done before holy shit business in order for the fans to go.
22:38That this is where we need to elevate you. Do you remember who was in your Myspace top eight? I had a lot of people.
22:43I would shuffle it out. You know? What an honor that would be.
22:46Cute girls at the time that I was like, oh, I gotta put her in there. I'd like to meet this girl at some point. How quickly did Tom get out of the Myspace topic?
22:52Tom was in there for a bit because he was a buddy. But then real? Yeah.
22:56Yeah. Oh, yeah. I know Tom.
22:59Tom was a a friend, and and, of course, it was like then it became almost like like, you know, what would somebody send a sufi picture?
23:09Or maybe they were the one to get me in their town, and I'd say, oh, you brought me to this place I've never been before. I'm gonna put you in my top eight for the entire honor that would be.
23:19It was cool, man. It was yeah. I really loved that whole experience.
23:23That that era of the Internet was a lot of fun. There's a whole generation that won't even know the honor that it was to be in someone's Myspace top eight.
23:33Yeah. It because it wasn't at all corporate. That was a website that didn't feel even though, you know, there was money behind it, it was just a whole different strategy and just the whole rigmarole had nothing to didn't feel like it felt like the Wild West.
23:48It didn't feel like there was anything to do with, like, algorithms and who gets what or, you know, a currency stream.
23:57And it it really was just like a hang. You know? So if you were on the cutting edge then
24:02of Myspace, what do you see with, like, TikTok right now? Because I feel like that's kind of maybe twenty years later what that was doing then.
24:10Yeah. It's like
24:12there's still an ability to craft something and create something that's wholly original.
24:20I mean, I know TikTok's a lot of things. There's a lot of different kinds of content. You put a lot of content out on TikTok.
24:26I I I mean, I love it. I I don't think I've engaged with anything outside of maybe for a little while I was doing things like Clubhouse. You know, I love doing podcast stuff, but TikTok was the first one in a long time that and I know them behind the scenes.
24:42And when they approached me and I was like, this is kinda how I would like to use this as a hub for the next, you know, era of my my comedy. They were it it felt like that Myspace of it all, where it was kinda like, what can we do to help you cultivate the audience that you want in here?
24:59So I like those that group of people's great, and I think that it's it's incumbent upon the creator to come up with something that, of course, is gonna get eyes on it.
25:08But even more importantly is you have to have a long form game plan to where you wanna take your audience, where you wanna take your career.
25:18So I try to tell, young, especially comics, like, don't be in such a rush to feel like you gotta get that 5,000,000 views on so and so.
25:29Because trust me, when you get it, you gotta be ready. And if you're not, and that next number slips down to nothing Yeah. It's gonna feel it's gonna feel like you're over, and you're not.
25:42It's just the way society imbibes on content.
25:46But if you've got like your character, your persona, you've mapped out where you want to take your audience, you know how to communicate that, then you have a real chance at utilizing those machines to .
26:03But if you don't have a machine of your own, that machine will use you, and then you'll be sitting a year later going, man, that was like, why didn't that sustain? And it's because you didn't have a sustaining plan.
26:16What's the thing you're driving people toward? The special right now? The special.
26:20It's it's really for me And the next special after that is Yeah. I mean, it's it's really, you know, like, permission to speak freely. Of course.
26:28I wanted to create the most incredibly beautiful comedy special with one of the most legendary directors who I've worked with twice before, Marty Culner. He directed Vicious Circle, argue arguably one of the most beautiful comedy specials.
26:44You know, he made that arena. I mean, it was I I just remember looking at the footage saying, Marty, like, you made me look like beyond what I even thought I was doing up here.
26:55And then we did isolated incident. When I called Marty on this, I I said I want to set the bar again. You know?
27:01A lot of people followed suit, you know, after doing the arena show. I I could watch a lot of people and go, this looks like what we did.
27:09This has the same kind of Yeah. And and yet before that, people were like, this isn't a comedy show. This feels like, you know, this isn't really but it is.
27:17You know, when you can be right in the middle and it's like four theaters are around you at any given point. And so called Marty and said, you know, I'm ready to to do something that I think is a game changer.
27:31And so pitched him on the idea, my house, Hollywood Hills, drones, but really more than anything, the content. Letting people in, not just in my home, you know, that's what it thematically was, but I'm letting people in closer to my experiences.
27:47Sometimes it's funny self deprecating. Sometimes it's a little cocksure because I've done a lot of cool shit. And sometimes it's like, here's where I failed so badly and had, you know, traumatic capsizing experiences that I can now laugh at.
28:02I said, so it's gonna be aesthetically beautiful, but it's gonna be introspective and unbelievably funny because I'm more present at 31 than I've ever been before.
28:12I love
28:14film, and I love that you shot this at IMAX. Yeah. Yeah.
28:16Yeah. Like, that's insane. Yeah.
28:17We found IMAX
28:19standard with quality cameras just because I knew I wanted to upscale it and and show it on an IMAX screen. I was like, this feels so cinematic.
28:28And so we have that. Like, that's like
28:32Christopher Nolan really, like, changed the game. Like, when because IMAX for the longest time was, like, science documentaries. Right.
28:39Right. And then he was like, let's film the Dark Knight Right. Using IMAX cameras.
28:43Yeah. Him and James Cameron, obviously, like, you know, really avatar, you know, made made things
28:48feel more immersive, you know? And that's Do you think this is gonna be a new trend?
28:51Like, comedy specials shot on IMAX? If I could cross my fingers and make a wish, it's like, I hope that after people see this at we're gonna do Man's Chinese Theater as the opening night, I hope that some theater people see it and say, maybe we should do a run of this or do the next one thinking of it more in this, you know, in this way.
29:14An event type of, you know, film situation. I don't know. I mean, I just know that I'm just happy we're showing it one time on a big screen in front of a great audience.
29:21And if you're gonna debut it in any theater in Los Angeles, like, that's the one That's it. That's where all the big movies That's right. Do.
29:27Yeah. It's still referred to as the Chinese theater. That's what people call it.
29:32The TCL Chinese theater. Formally Yeah. Man's, but we we know it now as the TCL Chinese theater.
29:39And it's a beautiful
29:40historic location. Did you call it above it all because your house is above everybody else?
29:45It was it that was, you know, kinda like the second meaning, but really it was about, like, you know, staying above negativity, staying above people to you know, people take your People will hijack your narrative in this business.
30:01Happens a lot. It happens every day. Something gets written about you, and the court of public opinion says that's more interesting than the reality of it, and they go with it.
30:10And so there's me, and then there's a version of me that lives on the Internet that is kind of fascinating to watch how that version of myself gets piecemealed and put through the spanking machine, or even sometimes lauded for things that you're like, I don't know.
30:26That was just a cool thing I did. I didn't expect it would be so shimmery. So above it all was really me being like, staying above maybe early in my career ego, and things like hubris and stuff that gets into you when you're a young person who has all this fame and success out of the the blue.
30:43And then also staying above a lot of negativity. And sometimes when people come to take your legs out from under you because everybody wants your spot at some point.
30:53So above it all really was that. And, yes, of course, that beautiful view and being able to look out and, you know, stay inspired.
31:01Why was there so much negativity that followed you around? Like, when you were at the peak of your popularity.
31:06Yeah. I think it was a I think it was a few things. I know that it was, you know, there was a lot of envy.
31:13There was a lot of people that felt like there was a certain pecking order, and there really isn't. You know? You just get picked at some point and thrown on the cover of Rolling Stone or whatever starts to take over.
31:26Other people look at that and they're frustrated. And so sometimes people well, actually, a lot of people have come to me years later and said, I'm one of those people that pig piled on you because I was frustrated.
31:37I was tired of going on a morning radio show, trying to get a few 100 people maybe to my gig, and the first thing they would say is, well, Dane Cook's doing this, why don't you do what he do he does? And and so I understood it as that, and then it was also something I never understood because my dad was a athlete.
31:55And I thought that the arts were going to be like athleticism or like being a sports figure, where it was like just stats based. And I quickly learned that being self made in a business that wants to write you up or write you down, you take the power away from them, the industry.
32:16And so at some point, the pitchforks are out because like, oh, you wrote yourself up, but now we get to of undress you here. So it was that.
32:25And I just think it was just like a multitude of things that were going to happen one way or the other, because that's kind of where a career takes you.
32:35You've got to be like the belle of the ball. And they've got to make you feel like you're more special than you are. And then they have to have to almost like the American way, where it's like, now you have to have the fall, and they have to dissect you.
32:50And you have to talk about either your trauma or what you're encumbered by. And then you get to get back up, and that's when everybody does the slow clap, and then you're kind of in for the rest.
33:02That's really like the way that our narrative in this country likes to it's that John Travolta thing, right? Yeah. The biggest and the best, Saturday Night Fever in Greece.
33:11Then it's like making fun of him because he's on talking baby movies or whatever he had to do to take care of his livelihood or whatever he needed. And it was just like disparaging and discouraging.
33:21And I'm sure probably hurt a lot for him to be like, man, I was the biggest thing in this And then, you know, a pulp fiction or something, and everybody goes, we knew you were the best.
33:34And it's kind of like, I saw the writing on the wall with it, and after I had kind of like my major moment and then a fall down moment, I was actually kind of Okay with it. I was like, oh, the pressure's off, and now I can just roll back into this with passion and the fans that stuck by me that were meant to be there in the first place.
33:55There was a point when you were kind of like the
34:00nickel back of comedy. Like, where it was like, it was really cool to not like you. Right.
34:05But at the same time, your numbers were speaking for themselves. Like, you were selling out arenas, but people were like, oh, yeah.
34:12But, like, I I don't like them. Right. Well but I'm
34:16not looking at that at the time because I'm looking at 20,000 people that love me. So anytime everybody wants to go, like, what was it like to I go, you know, I guess if the point counterpoint is I was on the cover of Time Magazine in the same year that people were saying I sucked as one of the most influential people on the planet and accepting that I was.
34:37I knew I'd use this Internet in a way that nobody I got there first and then figured it out, so I could actually sit there and be like, this is true. Yeah. I am an influential person.
34:48I don't know more than this year, and I definitely think if they did an issue called where did they misstep, I would have been on the cover of a few of those.
34:56But I never was down, even when people were taking potshots, because I've never not had an audience.
35:06I've never had an audience I'm fortunate that I never had an audience abandon me, to where I'm like, I can't do gigs. Thirty one years, I've never not performed.
35:16And if I tell people I'm at a place, they come out. So that only helped business because it made me more interesting than I actually really am, which is a homebody.
35:31I do my gig. I do these big, massive shows. And then I actually thought, man, I'm just kind of a pretty average guy.
35:41And yet that version of me, either loved or hated, was so much more interesting for people to
35:47parse. Right. And it was very good for business.
35:51Do people ever think that you on stage is not authentic?
35:56I think years ago, people felt like, oh, the energy's a put on, and it's just this whirling dervish of energy, but like, what's he really like? And you're like, but actually I've never done drugs or you know Never. Never drank, yeah.
36:08Yeah, but I also knew at that time I was not false, but I didn't have all the accoutrements that I wanted to build up as well rounded performer. I knew I broke even though it took a lot of years, I still was like, I'm only fifteen years into this.
36:23Like, I have so much to learn. I I I have a lot of things that I I need to Fifteen years in any other career?
36:29Like, you're, like, you're a veteran. Right. And yet I knew that fifteen years in, I I could look and go, alright.
36:36If there's 20 boxes that I've seen other comics that I wanna emulate and love, I I check eight. You know?
36:43Or I could talk to my comedian friends and be like, man, remember in 2011, I walked into the laugh factory, and for the first time in my career, I planted my feet.
36:55I did not take the mic out of the stand, and I said, for one year, I'm not going to move. I need to learn complete stillness.
37:04I need to learn to tell a story right here. I love physicality, and I always wanna add that as flair.
37:11But I was like, I need to learn absolute stillness in vernacular only. I need to be funny quite simply by telling you something poignant because I want to talk about poignant things Yeah.
37:22And I want to be introspective. But if you're talking about something that's very genuine and you're adding this, now that's a distraction. This works if that's part of the character.
37:32But when I'm talking about like, for example, I I have a story in the news special about a stalker that I have, that I've been dealing with. Open case LAPD.
37:41A violent stalker. A person who has physically threatened to kill him. Man or a woman?
37:47It's a woman.
37:49I knew that if I was gonna make that story funny, because there is funny, crazy shit in this story, the only way that I would eventually in my career be able to tell a story that that's that is that real and stark and caustic and meaningful is if I just tell you like this.
38:08This woman said, I'm going to kill you. I'm gonna find you, and I'm gonna murder you.
38:15And I remember sitting there and thinking, man, I wish I read this after I ate this pizza because I've been waiting all it was like, I was finding humor.
38:25Yeah. Because also, I grew up in a family that humor helped us to get it was a coping mechanism.
38:34So even with this scary thing that I was dealing with, I I could find humor to cope because I was really scared, genuinely. But the 2011 planting my feet in 2022 is the best fucking decision I could have made back then.
38:50Because now I can I can just be completely transparent?
38:55And then I can put the what's that? Was that difficult? No.
38:58Because I got I got good at it. There's other things that are difficult still. I don't if I want it.
39:04Like, there are other elements that I, you know man, I'm still learning. I'm 31 years, and I still feel like there's things that I could be better at, ways that I could, you know, dovetail into certain things.
39:15And I might say to you, like, man, I've gotten really I'm, you know, I'm laser with, like, improv and you not seeing the stitches between jokes.
39:25I can segue, but then I can find other things that that I'm still desperately trying to figure out the ultimate way to I'm a storyteller, I'm not a joke teller.
39:35Yeah. So I want three acts in everything I tell you. Yeah.
39:38I wanna be able to have three acts, and the way that I construct most of my humor is like this. There's an act one, which is like the information. There's an act two, which is the dark center of the joke or whatever that might be.
39:51Then there's an in between with act two to three, and it's improv. And I'm gonna play off the crowd, or I'm gonna find something new, and I give myself permission to leave the joke, to explore my feelings.
40:02Something I learned from Chappelle. I started off with Dave in New York City, and I would watch Dave. He could be so poignant, and he could really feel a feeling in real time and then add it into the routine.
40:15So it was like learning from the people that I came up with to go, if I can have a prewritten piece of material that is formulaic and funny, but I can put something very real at any given time in it. So that's in between act two and three, and then the act three is what?
40:30The punch line Yeah. Yeah. The button, the tag, and then stitch, stitch, stitch, the segue, and you shouldn't know any of that.
40:38You should only be laughing and enjoying, and you're not realizing, to me, that's three years of working on that piece
40:45to make something that should just feel like we're just shooting the shit. But you're such a great storyteller. Thanks, man.
40:50Yeah, love it. That's what makes you so good at what you do. I
40:54truly genuinely appreciate that because I I I love it. There's a story
41:00a clip from a story on YouTube with you and Dave Chappelle. I'm sure you know the story I'm talking about, the laugh factory, where it it's supposed to be Dane's night, and Dave Chappelle shows up.
41:10Not true. That none of that story is true? No.
41:13And apparently,
41:14Dave got this tight 10 and The guy that yeah. Yeah. Okay.
41:17So You know the whole thing. Yeah. But the guy that told the story even told the story by saying, I heard this thing, and I don't know, but I heard and it was like he prefaced it by saying that Dave came in and basically because it was my night that Dave did a set and then said, hey, everybody.
41:33Join me outside for a cigarette. And then the arena And then the crowd just followed Dave And the guy was like, this is like 2,006 or seven.
41:40Let me tell you something. Dave and I were both at the peak of our power at 02/1967. You know, him at the Chappelle show and just everything in his life that was happening.
41:48And, you know, me from this meteoric like, the two people you're not leaving a room at that era was me and Dave.
41:55I mean, I'm not trying to sound like, you know, so, like, it's just not true.
42:00So he didn't say, let's go outside. I'm gonna go No.
42:04I just saw David Summercamp. I did his his Yellow Springs show.
42:08Like, he's like I adore that guy. We would never do anything to try to to underhand, you know, to to take away from one another.
42:16Both of us know probably more than most people that, you know, this isn't this isn't the job that this isn't a good look in this job to try to take something away from somebody else.
42:30Yeah. And Dave would never do that. And people that believe that, I know it's a good story and it sounds fun to tell, but it's like, he would never have done that to me.
42:38There's, like, 6,000,000
42:40views on that. 6,000,000 people that you're saying people have been lied to. You're you just set the record straight.
42:46Yeah. Maybe this will get 12,000,000 views Alright. We'll see.
42:48And everyone will see. We'll see. Actually, it's a it's such a good story.
42:51It's like, let it be out there. Yeah. You know how it is.
42:53Yeah. It's all But the title of it is like Dave Chappelle savagely ruins ruins Dane Cook's career.
43:03Right. That's just so ridiculous.
43:08Yeah. I mean, I was also, um, in a magazine article once that said I was dating, uh, Rihanna. Oh, that's nice.
43:16She came to the show, and then there was this whole breakdown of, like, we went to the Pacific Palisades. And, like, for years, my friends were like, man, what was that like? I'm like, never met her.
43:24You know? These things just had it's fodder. It's like the Internet is ready?
43:29This is what the Internet is. It's just waiting for one person to say it so everybody can believe it. One person says it.
43:36We've seen it recently with people that something really terrible is said. One person says it, and then everybody runs with it. And it's like that on the good side and the bad side.
43:46Sometimes people can say something that, like, this person's a hero because they once saved the dog from a fire, and that person's like, I never did that. I called the fire department, but I never ran into the And so that's all the Internet's waiting for us.
44:00One good sounding story to go, let's latch onto that. It's like a big game of broken telephone.
44:07Yeah. No, the Internet is the Internet is a it's a it's a TV program.
44:13It's one show Yeah. With remember Three's Company was all about misdirection?
44:18Jack would hear something, and then the whole episode is I heard the tail end of a What a great reference. Three's Company. The whole Internet is just, I think I heard a thing, and then somebody else goes, well, I'll meme it.
44:29And then another person says, a source said and then all of a sudden, you're just watching this thing, you're like, well, that was fun, but that's not me. There's
44:38there's so many parts of your career where I feel like
44:43you were already at a really big level, and then you took it to another big level. And I feel like the movies for you were a really big part of that. Yeah.
44:49It was fun because that, like, when movies came around, it was really just fans of the stand up that suddenly are hitting you up saying, you know, do you wanna play in this sandbox for a little bit? You know? I didn't I wanted to do film, and I had hoped to, you know, broaden my my aspirations.
45:05But for me it was like, I'll just follow where stand up takes me. And then it took me to some really interesting places. It continues to, you know, every once in while my phone rings and it's like, you know, Mel Brooks, like, you wanna do the producers at the Hollywood Bowl?
45:17And it's like, I just continue to feed the stand up because what comes from it is it's fascinating.
45:24What was the movie that really, like, took it up, you think?
45:29I mean, on the comedy side, definitely My Best Friend's Girl was, like, the one that I felt like for me, you know, just as a performer and a producer. I'm I'm really proud of that. You know, the other comedies were a lot of fun, but I sometimes signed on late, and it was like, show up and I'm just part of another person's ride or vision.
45:49But I produced that with Lionsgate, and I got to really build that character and script from the ground up. And then on the drama side, it was like, man, Dan in Real Life, Peter Hedges gave me the opportunity to show vulnerability.
46:03Such a sleeper, great movie. Yeah, it really is. And it's like, with Disney plus now, all these things like planes or that new audiences and families are finding them.
46:14But probably Mr. Brooks, I got to play a real salacious, you know, lascivious character.
46:19And I I mean, honestly, man, it's just like I've been really lucky. I've been lucky to you know, lady luck once in a while just throws me something that's so you know, I've done song and dance at Hollywood Bowl with V Mel Brooks.
46:33I've worked with Jerry Lewis. I've worked with some of the greats, the Kevin Costners, and then I've had the chance to just continue to create things like Above It All and do something that I feel like is
46:44the heart and soul of who I am, which is a person that just wants to make people laugh. Where does the process begin? Like, so Above It All is about to come out, and you told me off camera you're already working on the next special.
46:54That's right. So is just workshopping
46:58stuff? Is it writing jokes down? What is it?
47:00Yeah. I mean, it's for me, it always starts with what's the piece of material that is really, like, where I'm at right now in my life.
47:10Right? What's something that, like, you know, am I deeply in love? Am I at the opposite?
47:16Am I just like, you know, The Bachelor out on the town? Am I trying to escape in my life?
47:22Am I trying to be more centered? Everything is a through line and a theme. And with this, the bit that I told a story about five years ago, it's been five, with the pandemic it was like a pause and then working on it again.
47:37So this is the longest incubation period of like, usually it's a couple years and you film it, right? Yeah, yeah.
47:42But this is four years, almost five with some of this material. And I tell a story about the first really bad hell gig that I did, and it was really humiliating.
47:55And I walked people through this whole story. I told her five years ago, and I was like, when I go on the next stage to do a show for television, I'm gonna tell that that's gonna be the crux.
48:09And so it starts with one thing and I kinda build build out from there. So, I mean, you are in love right now. Right?
48:14We both just got engaged. That's right. Congratulations.
48:16Congratulations. For both of us. Yeah.
48:18Right? Right? I didn't I didn't make a comedy bit about it, though.
48:22I did. It's in the trailer for this. Yeah.
48:26Yeah. I I definitely you know, I can't do a stand up comedy special or album without talking about relationships in some way, cause it's the one through line that fans always want.
48:37Fans always want something in there about, you know, a makeup, a breakup, cheating, you know, being you know, being like, you know, sowing your oats.
48:46At every point in my career since I was 19 years old, people want some kind of like, you know, something to do with like falling in or falling out of love. In fact, Troublemaker, that whole special, speaking of like theme and through line, I called it Troublemaker because my whole goal was to break people up.
49:03And I broke a lot of people up with that special. A lot of people broke What it bit specifically? No, the whole thing.
49:07The whole it's just a savage I say at the beginning of that show, I'm like, you know, if you make it through this comedy routine, you're gonna look at the person you're with at the end, and you're either gonna be better from it, or I'm gonna ruin you.
49:24And it was like and and I said, and you're gonna be glad because I'm either gonna, like, end this because you're not meant to be together, or you'll know that because of the and so I cultivated a whole set that I felt like I was a troublemaker.
49:36It was like I was gonna rabble rouse Man. And make make people break up, or a lot of people wrote me and said, we got married after that special. We we knew we were right for each other after that special.
49:47Does your fiance ever go, please, we don't need to talk more about our relationship. Oh, no. She's very funny.
49:52She's super funny, and she is man, she's like silver tongued. So it's like, you know, you're a comedian.
50:00You wanna be with somebody who, first of all, thinks you're funny. Right? That helps.
50:04Sure. But if you you could be with somebody who's also kind of funny, but Kelsey is like, I can't even repeat some of the things that you know, like, she'll go there.
50:13Like, I'll say some crazy shit, and then she'll stay say stuff that makes me go, I cannot believe you just said that. I mean, she's she's awesome. Look.
50:21You don't even have to be a comedian to want your partner to think you're funny. Like, if my fiance didn't think I was funny Right. This would not work.
50:28Right. You know, when you're with somebody and, like, you'd say something funny and every once in a while they just look you be like, that is not funny. I get that a lot.
50:36It just it just steals your soul. So to be with somebody that, like I mean, also, we we we laugh a lot. We're always having a good time.
50:42Rachel gives me this one. She'll be like, you think you're so funny,
50:47Like, aren't I?
50:50No. Not right now. Yikes.
50:52Not right now. Okay. That's fair.
50:53Okay. That's fair. Not right now is okay.
50:56I'll take a not right now every once in while. She's hungry or a little low blood sugar. It's like, but, you know, when it's like when, you know, when somebody's like, try harder, then it's like, okay.
51:06Back to the open mics. What's the piece of advice that you dole out now to comedians that are coming out or coming up? I try to tell them the best advice I ever got, and it's the only thing that they should ever hear from another comedian, which is you know better than anybody what you should be doing up there.
51:25Okay? My whole gear with, you know, being in a mentor situation with forget about comedians, but anybody kind of on the come up in the arts is I will fight anybody away from you so you can keep your integrity.
51:41You have to just you know, you know I don't know. I I would never even dare to say to somebody like, you should be doing this. You should chain I stay far away from that.
51:52I most of my mentorship is, like, on the on the legalese side. I've been through so much stuff legally that I I feel like I'm the one who says, like, let's read your contract together.
52:03Do you know how to read a contract? Do you know the things that you should be looking out for? Oh, it's 40 pages.
52:08That's already a contract you don't want. Boiler room. This can be three pages.
52:13If somebody hands you a 40 page contract, you're in rough shape. So my whole mentor thing is like helping a comic, especially comics.
52:24Doesn't even matter if I think it's the funniest thing. It's like what you believe in, in your messaging, that's what you need to get to the core of.
52:34And stay away from the noise of other comics and other people saying, you shouldn't do that, or that's offensive, or it's like, that's what you sign up for. This job is about turning people off.
52:44As much as you think it's about making people laugh, you're never gonna make everybody love you. You're never gonna be funny to everybody all the time. So you're signing up for a your success comes at the heels of people not liking what you do.
53:01So you have to be able to go, oh, I'm I'm I've got my strong opinion. Yeah. They don't like it, but they're laughing a lot.
53:08And early in a comedy career, sometimes you go, oh, man, these people weren't laughing. And you you're like, that makes you feel bad. It's, like, good.
53:16That's actually good. You want them laughing, them to be like, I don't I'm not into this.
53:21So that's about pushing the envelope as much as you possibly can? It's not even it's not even, like, the envelope of, like, oh, I'm saying things that are, like, so obtuse and, like no. It's quite literally, like, some people's sense of humor is, like, dull, or they're gonna be into something that's, like, they love very political like, it's not even pushing the envelope.
53:42It's it's going, these are the things that are funny to me. This is what I'll say. There's two kinds of comics, and this is the comic I wanted to be versus some comics do this.
53:52Some comics write and think, what is funny to them?
53:57What is funny that they that they will laugh at and latch onto? And they write from that. But the comics I loved were what's funny to me, and how can I bring people into my world?
54:07And maybe their flex of that are gonna make them go like, oh, that's like that speaks to me. That's what you want.
54:14Them not laughing, them cracking up. And And if you can do that, you start to know like, oh, I I think I I think I have a a persona that as time goes on, those people won't show up for the show.
54:27Yeah. More of these people will. Yeah.
54:30I just wanna thank you for always being so genuine. Oh, man. Dude, Always being so generous with your time and your wisdom.
54:36Love talking shop. You know, it's like when when we first started DMing, I was like, you know, this is just this is what I wanna be doing. Talking stand up and talking about, you know, creating something from nothing and saying, like, how can we we how can we make more Yeah.
54:51People you know, just have the the time of their life for a little while, escape everything, turn on a comedy show that's really beautiful as well, and go,
55:01this is a nice little pause from all that other stuff. I love that you're so passionate about it that you're like, oh, when we're done here, I'm gonna go swing by the laugh factory. I'm
55:10pretty exhausted. I've done a bunch of interviews and a lot of stuff today,
55:15as I'm doing every day. But it's because I want to talk about it. I want to keep going.
55:19I'm excited. I end every conversation with the same question because I'm all about gratitude. I start and end every day saying out loud three things that I'm grateful for.
55:27Yeah. So what are three things in your life that you're grateful for right now? Love.
55:31Grateful for love. You know? It it makes it's the adhesive, man.
55:36It makes everything else everything that I thought was great about, like, having whatever passion or creativity or everything was, like, in, like, hitting the nitro button in a, you know, fast car already once, like, I really had genuine love in my life, both being able to really give it and really receive it in its truest form.
55:59I I will echo that too. Yeah, man. Love is Changes your life.
56:02Changes it it it it narrows the scope in a way you want it to be. Yeah. When you're a young man, it's like, you know, you're looking at everything all at once and try but once you have that person, especially that one person who just they love you for the things that you accomplish, don't accomplish, just your passion and what you give to them and how what I think is important, how you champion them.
56:28The best kind of relationship this is a relationship, Shona is like, they're into your goals and want to help you. You're into their goals and unselfishly just want to help them.
56:38And then you've got some stuff together that you're looking forward to doing. If you can have that triangulation, hold on to that.
56:45That's what you want the rest of your life. Two other things. That there's a stage somewhere that I can get on for a little while in the pandemic, it felt like it was gone.
56:53I never thought stand up would be gone. I always looked at stand up as if everything else goes away, we'll always need laughter. Sure.
57:00And then suddenly that was gone. And that was, like, gut wrenchingly depressing.
57:10Yeah. I mean, I didn't even know what I was feeling when I was exploring that idea of, like, I I may never do it again.
57:19Like, I don't know what the world's gonna do, but, like, I may never be with a group of people in a building making them laugh in that way again. So gratitude to be able to get on a stage somewhere and not only that, but just be able to get on a stage.
57:32And also, it's still the last place that you can really go, unless people are filming it and sharing it. And just share thoughts, and it doesn't all have to make sense or always be, you know It's still a place a bit like a speakeasy that you can go into and just talk some smack, and most people are cool with that and understand it's jokes.
57:55So that, and then the third that I got to I'm always grateful, and not a day goes by where I don't thank God that I got to show my mom and dad everything that they hoped for me.
58:09Everything that they the pieces that they saw of possibility, and yet all the obstacles and being self loathing and having all that, you know, fear. When I was a kid, anxiety and being what I told you about, which is just like not really having a lot of self worth as a young person.
58:28And I'm thinking about it now, that I got to hug them and show them that I could do this incredible thing in front of all these thousands of people and make them laugh.
58:40So those three things are that's it. I can't wait to see what's next for you.
58:44I can't wait to see this. I can't wait to see this. This is it.
58:48You know? This is like you know, I don't know what I would even do past this.
58:51I usually always have an idea. Like, I'm working on the next one now, but I can't honestly say because I'm still trying to discover what is that theme moment. This is like this is something I look at and go, man, I I just don't know what I would do past this.
59:05I I've played a lot of stages that I got to play Radio City in 2019, and that was, like, the last place that I really felt like I need to play.
59:16And when I did that show, I remember leaving there and feeling like, I don't have another stage that I have to play in the world. There's not another place.
59:25I've performed for all the troops. I've done the greatest USO shows.
59:30Those are things that were really important to me. And I got to do, obviously, Madison Square Garden, Boston Garden, a bunch of great arena shows, but those classic locations.
59:40But it was always Radio City that I wanted to play in my house. I always wanted to do this show. So I don't know what's next, but I too am excited to try to figure it out.
59:48Dude, thank you so much. Oh, man. You got it.
59:50Thank you, Chris. Appreciate it.
The Hook
The bait, then the rug-pull.
The first comedy set Dane Cook ever performed — he did it under a stolen name. When the open-mic host called for Ernest Glenn and nobody answered, a 19-year-old Dane stepped up, claimed the slot, and walked off 10 minutes later knowing exactly what he was going to do with his life. Thirty-one years and thousands of shows later, he still can't find the real Ernest Glenn.
